Giffard serial numbers

[j_potter]

does anyone on here know anything about giffard serial numbers? i have just purchased an 8mm rifle with
the number 2085. i'am wondering how many they made and where this one might be in the production run.

[wild boar]

i have 4533 and its the rifle version but i dont know the age of it - be nice if there was a bit of a database made of the numbers , i dont know of the changes if any that were made thru production either

[j_potter]

a bit of snooping around and i've come up with the following that were sold at auction over the last seven
years.

8mm rifle 801
8mm rifle 2085
4.5mm rifle 2322
4.5mm rifle 2809
8mm rifle 3833
8mm rifle 4533
8mm rifle 8549
8mm shotgun 9399
8mm shotgun 9706

what i'am now wondering is if they made a batch of one particular caliber followed by a batch of a different
one but the serial numbers ran sequentially from number 1 onwards. does anyone know what was usual
practice with other gun manufacturers at the time?

[Strever]

i have 2 8mm rifles and they both have 5 digit serial #'s one is 22842 other is 33141
i am thinking this indicates a pretty large production run

does anyone on here know anything about giffard serial numbers? i have just purchased an 8mm rifle with
the number 2085. i'am wondering how many they made and where this one might be in the production run.

[draitzer]

Here are a few serial numbers I've noted. There were more than one manufacturer for the Giffard CO2 guns as noted below - several of the 4.5 cal rifles had very tiny stampings that were completely "xxx-ed-out"; could this mean the barrels were made by one outfit then taken over by another for completion of the rifles? The "xxx-outs" all had simple ribbed buttplates and spherical bolt knobs with a large slot, no knurling.

Cal S/N Type Mfr
4.5 77 pistol ?
4.5 27 pistol St. Etienne
4.5 4737 rifle ?
4.5 5906 rifle xxx
4.5 3931 rifle xxx
4.5 2722 rifle xxx
6 5555 rifle St. Etienne
8 4605 rifle St. Etienne
8 342 rifle St. Stephanoise

Hope this is of interest,
Don R.

[j_potter]

many thanks for these replies. if i manage to collect a reasonable list i'll put it
on here for future reference. interesting that strever's numbers are much higher
than any others i've come across.

[DCL_dave]

many thanks for these replies. if i manage to collect a reasonable list i'll put it
on here for future reference. interesting that strever's numbers are much higher
than any others i've come across.

I know nothing about Giffards...but I love a mystery

A bit of digging around has found that serial No. 7177 - an 8mm shot and ball gun, is in the next sale at Holts (link to lot 605) but it is interesting that the sale info makes note of the fact that the co2 cylinder seems to be marked with a different serial number - 29689, so, perhaps the really high numbers that have been seen are actually those of the co2 cylinders rather than the actual guns that they're attached to?

I would make sense that there are/were a lot more co2 cylinders about than guns as , iirc, back when these were made, the co2 cylinder was returned to the manufacturer to be refilled?...(I think!...is that right? )

[j_potter]

yes dave, you're right. my 8mm rifle has a serial number of 2085 but the resevoir is stamped
31250. another curious point is that i've yet to find two guns with identical engraving.

[wild boar]

yes my res is no. 6549 i never noticed the difference but i did notice that every part on the rifle seems to be stamped with the serial no. somewhere.
mine has a balloon in front of the loading hole also but i have seen some in pics with a star in a square type emblem on there - don't know why they are different

[draitzer]

The reservoirs do have their own serial numbers - maybe the original one was identically numbered to its gun, but for sure the intent was to swap out cylinders by sending them someplace for refilling. I recall one pistol claimed to have a number same as its frame - maybe that one was never actually used enough to require a fill!

Don R.

[Garvin]

The reservoirs do have their own serial numbers - maybe the original one was identically numbered to its gun, but for sure the intent was to swap out cylinders by sending them someplace for refilling. I recall one pistol claimed to have a number same as its frame - maybe that one was never actually used enough to require a fill!

Don R.

The business model of swapping cylinders via the dealer/distributor every time you needed a refill definitely seems to have been the Achilles heel of the Giffard! You wouldn't have been too happy to get a battered one in return for your pristine cylinder either, I imagine.

I suppose rich people might have bought several cylinders along with the rifle, although I haven't seen one with multiple cylinders for sale so far.

mine has a balloon in front of the loading hole also but i have seen some in pics with a star in a square type emblem on there - don't know why they are different

I've also seen a few of these ones, apparently with the balloon mark stamped out. Could they have been 'rebadged' by a different company and wanted to obliterate the Giffard link? For instance, I've seen the 'MF' stamp of the St Etienne factory that made the Giffards instead of the balloon.

Some Giff eye candy here:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/681456/

[aimless]

This is my private list. ? = uncertain, Gewehr = rifle, Schrot = smooth-bore

(The # 136 is for sale. More pictures on request. She is a early marked "Societe stephanoise d ´armes St. Etienne" .)
If you take a look at the production-hall and -process, you can imagine, that there can be no regularity ref. serial-numbers and type or caliber.


http://sta.sh/01gokvk823on

http://sta.sh/029rpu7mq4xu

http://sta.sh/01h2dnhjhjw3

[DT Fletcher]

The business model of swapping cylinders via the dealer/distributor every time you needed a refill definitely seems to have been the Achilles heel of the Giffard! You wouldn't have been too happy to get a battered one in return for your pristine cylinder either, I imagine.

There was no other option, besides exchange. The Giffard was only introduced when CO2 became commercially available in Paris in 1890. The business model of the CO2 company was to use the Giffard as a way of advertising just one of the practical uses of CO2. The business model was to sell the public on CO2, the Giffard was a means to that end.