Help stripping and sorting a HW35k

[loiner1965]

Did you ever check the power output of the Vantage on another chrono as those power figures seem very high?

Do you still have it?

If so, maybe it's time for a re-build and re-acquaint yourself with this beautiful rifle. If you wanted to keep it more in line with its Venom heritage, Lyn Lewington (venoman on here) may be able to supply a V-Mach kit for it? Tinbum and Welsh Willy kits also available. All will deliver a very nice and refined shooting experience befitting the old girl. And it should be easy to set it up so that it's comfortably under the limit.

P.S....good lad re whupping those PCPs.

i swapped a compound bow for it from another bbs member years ago as i always had a soft spot for hw77 and hw 80s.
i first checked the power with the chrono 24 as i was beating everyone with it and it did show 19ftlb with 7.9gn premiers.
i had 4 boxes of the 10.4 gns prems which should reduce power but it still was around 17 ftlb.
at the gun club we had a jow young pm 10 ???? chrono which showed similiar results as thats when paul hudson tried his hw97 with the same pellets to see if the chrono was faulty......he got similiar results.
it seems these pellets were just perfect and very tight in the chamber for both our barrels.
the spring i used in all my springers was a chap on here called pok .
to get to near enough 12 ftlb they was hardly any preload on the spring at all and you could more or less screw the end cap on.
i had a fac license so i darent use the rifle at the club as the president was a policeman and he knew the issue i had with it but said they would prosecute me if i was ever stopped.
so i dismantled the rifle.........it was still over the limit with other pellets but not as much as with premiers.....
i sold it to a chap on here and told him the set back trigger was playing up and needed attention ( i tried to fix it but caused more issues trying to do it )it wasnt the trigger at fault originally but it broke the spring which caused it to catch the trigger etc....
regardless he bought it and he said it still out performed all his rifles in the competitions and he got his best scores with it.
i think the original owner was vic thompson or he might have been the source for the compound bow as it was a long time ago around 2002
wish i still had it though.....
it wasnt difficult to cock either

[TonyL]

Yes, I remember Pok being on here. Seemed very knowledgeable and I think he had springs made to his own specifications. The stats on that spring remind me of the set-up with many V-Mach springs. Very easy to fit with less preload involved.

Bet you wish you still had it.

Mine's going nowhere.

[loiner1965]

pok told me they were exactly the same in coils / thickness / steel spec as venoms hence why i used them.
i had a rapid mk 1 as well but each week i took the hw77 to shoot against steyrs / mk 2 rapids and a mfr and beat them everytime.......it was then we realised it was over the limit by a long way.
if i didnt know the power it produced with premiers ( crosman premiers in the cardboard box were the pellets of choice in them days ) i could have kept it below 12ftlb with other pellets but the law says any pellet etc.
i just think the die 4 box was perfect for the hw barrel......the rifle didnt have any delrin buttons on the piston just the plain one.....it did have delrin piston guide though as my mate worked with delrin at the time.
he comes on here sometimes as he will remember it as he tried it out in his back garden and couldnt believe how smooth and accurate it was....
i do miss it though even though i dont have any air rifles now apart from my colchester game keeper.
it had been cocked so many times the bluing was worn away from the lever lol

[loiner1965]

Yes, I remember Pok being on here. Seemed very knowledgeable and I think he had springs made to his own specifications. The stats on that spring remind me of the set-up with many V-Mach springs. Very easy to fit with less preload involved.

Bet you wish you still had it.

Mine's going nowhere.

http://www.airgunbbs.com/showthread....=venom+vantage
here you are .....2005 thread about my venom which i first thought was a lazaglide then was corrected to be a vantage,
rifle was made in 1985 and my leupold efr was sat on it.......same scope been on my 30-06 / 308 and currently on my 223

[TonyL]

Thank you for that; all very interesting.

I was once given a box of 7.9 Premiers. None of the rifles owned by the nice chap that gave me them liked them. Wouldn't have a clue as to die number. I only tried them in one of my 95s at an indoor range at 34 yards and they were excellent, grouping more tightly than Superdome, Exacts (various stated head sizes) and AAF. I did later try H&N FTT and Baracuda FT, which just pip the Premiers in this rifle.

Don't you fancy getting a 77/97 again and re-living those fun, boingy days?

Norm, sorry, we seem to have wandered off slightly. Have your FAPs arrived?

[Mr.Fixit-Norm]

Thank you for that; all very interesting.

I was once given a box of 7.9 Premiers. None of the rifles owned by the nice chap that gave me them liked them. Wouldn't have a clue as to die number. I only tried them in one of my 95s at an indoor range at 34 yards and they were excellent, grouping more tightly than Superdome, Exacts (various stated head sizes) and AAF. I did later try H&N FTT and Baracuda FT, which just pip the Premiers in this rifle.

Don't you fancy getting a 77/97 again and re-living those fun, boingy days?

Norm, sorry, we seem to have wandered off slightly. Have your FAPs arrived?

Hi Tony,
That’s ok, I’ve gained a lot of knowledge on HW guns since the start, Topics often go off thread slightly but to me that’s what this place is all about

The FAPs turned up yesterday but I had company in the afternoon and was invited round to my brother in laws in the evening to help sort out the new dashcam he has, with the promise of a fish & chip tea followed by strawberries and ice cream - how could I resist

I’m going to try them today through the 35 as it is and depending on the result will either leave it or put one of Nicks preload washers he supplied to up it a bit.

I also ordered a Guntuff silencer adaptor which is slightly to small, rather than send it back, this is an excuse to pop to a local ironmongers and purchase a drill to open it out slightly. I’ll do this in the lathe for accuracy.

I’ve also found a piece of aluminium round bar just under 4” long which I’m thinking of turning into a sort of muzzle break

[Mr.Fixit-Norm]

Hi Tony,
That’s ok, I’ve gained a lot of knowledge on HW guns since the start, Topics often go off thread slightly but to me that’s what this place is all about

The FAPs turned up yesterday but I had company in the afternoon and was invited round to my brother in laws in the evening to help sort out the new dashcam he has, with the promise of a fish & chip tea followed by strawberries and ice cream - how could I resist

I’m going to try them today through the 35 as it is and depending on the result will either leave it or put one of Nicks preload washers he supplied to up it a bit.

I also ordered a Guntuff silencer adaptor which is slightly to small, rather than send it back, this is an excuse to pop to a local ironmongers and purchase a drill to open it out slightly. I’ll do this in the lathe for accuracy.

I’ve also found a piece of aluminium round bar just under 4” long which I’m thinking of turning into a sort of muzzle break

Well than didn’t quite go to plan, went to the local ironmongery place, 16mm Dormer drill - <£10 15mm Dormer drill <£9 15.5mm Dormer drill :



£50.25

I’ve ordered another guntuff adaptor in the right size

Never mind, more time for pellet testing, standby for FAP results later Tony

[Mr.Fixit-Norm]

Right ! Just when I thought the H&N pellets were good for my tuned 35k, Tony suggested trying the FAP pellets and these have won the race

I originally thought I’d put 25 shots over the chrono but turned out it was 27, anyway the results are as follows:

Average 584.6 ft/sec ( 10.2 ftlbs ) range 579-591 . ( 10.0-10.4ftlbs ) I reckon 11ft/sec spread is pretty damn good compared with what I was originally getting, and even that wasn’t so terrible !

I’m happy with the power at 10.2ftlbs so it looks like the Falcon accuracy plus are the pellets for my HW35k.

Once the silencer adaptor has arrived and I’ve fitted a muzzle break, the cocking effort ( for me ) should be spot on.

I dug out the Remington Express compact this afternoon and the cocking and firing is much worse that the 35k so that’s my next project.

I’ve got the action out of the stock but I’m slightly confused as to how to start stripping it. ?

Norm

[Mr.Fixit-Norm]

Right I’ve started stripping the Remington but I’m going to start a new thread ( all contributions welcome ) so this one on the HW35k doesn’t get ‘contaminated’

Norm

[Shed tuner]

yup.. especially as you'd had a relatively large power drop, which almost certainly means the reduced preload is causing the piston to stall much earlier, so a lighter pellet should help.. also try Falcon accuracy Plus - light and soft, with a low start pressure, so sould give a good uplift and a nicer shot cycle.

Right ! Just when I thought the H&N pellets were good for my tuned 35k, Tony suggested trying the FAP pellets and these have won the race

Cough good result though, me and Tony ain't going to fight over it...

I'm interested to know if you notice an improvement in the firing cycle with the Falcons ?

[Mr.Fixit-Norm]

Cough good result though, me and Tony ain't going to fight over it...

I'm interested to know if you notice an improvement in the firing cycle with the Falcons ?

I’m so sorry Shed Tuner, reading back through the (many) replies I realise you also recommended trying them, I do apologise for attributing the suggestion just to Tony

By firing cycle do you mean recoil & twang ?? If so I think there’s a bit less of each. It’s turned into a very nice little gun now and I’m really pleased with it.

I’ve got to be honest, since I went over to JSB’s a few years ago I’d lost track of pellet testing as everything I own seems to do well on them and with pellets increasing in price I’d never thought of trying others to see if I could squeeze a bit more accuracy and consistency out of the guns.

With three other rifles in 0.22 and having now got three different type of good pellets to try I’ll have to have a play once I’ve sorted the Remington

I’m hoping you’ve got some advice on that gun as well if you’re still talking to me after I left you out on the FAPs

Norm

[Shed tuner]

Yes less recoil (which will give rise to more twang if the spring is free to do so)...

If it's still twanging and the rear guide is fairly tight, make up a coke can piston sleave, holt it in place with the front top hat, gob in a bit of moly and job done.

FAPs are JSBs.. either the express or RS version, I forget.. one is 13.43 (same as FAPs), one is around 14.5

[evert]

FAPs are JSBs.. either the express or RS version, I forget.. one is 13.43 (same as FAPs), one is around 14.5

The RS is the lightest one at 13.4/7.3, and the Express is the 14.3grs/7.9grs version, depedning on caliber.

[TonyL]

Absolutely as Jon (Shed Tuner) says re the pellets and further tweaking advice, Norm, and evert re the pellets.. And, again, as Jon says re source of recommendation.. I think I may have mentioned the JSB RS earlier on in the thread, but it was Jon who suggested the FAP.. Matters not. All that matters is that you have had received an insight as to how different pellets can affect a gun's performance. So, with either power testing or accuracy, we should never fall into the trap of accepting a gun's performance based on how it does with just the one pellet type.. But, also as mentioned earlier, the pellet I would be choosing to use is the one that gives the best accuracy. But much of that is also dependant on exactly what you're using the rifle for.

This has been a most enjoyable and involving thread with a pleasing result. Nice one.

Sorry, I have never worked on the Remington so couldn't start to offer any advice on tuning them. I do seem to remember there being some threads covering the subject and it will be worth searching them out. Seem to remember reading that there are some differences with the methodology regarding removal and refitting the safety / trigger older vs newer examples? I hope you have as much fun fettling it.

[Mr.Fixit-Norm]

Following Shedtuners advice on piston sleeves, and not to overthink it I stripped the 35 down and looked around for a suitable sleeving material. I found some flexible clear plastic from the lid of a flash floor wipes tub but this proved to be too thick at 0.5mm

My search led me to the recycling bin and I dug out a 2L plastic milk container. I cut a big bit out of the side and it had a nice slippery feel to it. ( the label said it was PET ) it was also 0.2mm thick so ideal.

I worked out the internal circumference ( 75.36mm ) and made the sleeve 75mm x 100mm long. It rolled easily and I fitted it in so it went into the stepped area then put the delrin slip washer back which trapped it, making sure the small open slit was opposite the cocking slot as suggested

Then I added some more molyslip to the piston so that it lubricated the inner part of the sleeve ( should’ve done that first ). It was an interference fit now but I figured it would wear in a bit.

Reassembled and putting FAP pellets through it over the chrono it had lost a bit of power and was down from an average of 580ft/sec ( 10.2 ftlbs ) to 568 ( 9.7ftlbs ) but very consistent ( 563 - 572 ! ), which might be because the spring is a little tighter in the sleeve. I decided to add the remaining TBT delrin slip washer inside the piston and lo and behold despite only adding 3mm of preload the power went back to 587ft/sec 10.3ftlbs ( 583 - 591 spread ) with virtually no twang and no perceptible increase in cocking effort

Win win all round ( and a win on the Remy Express compact thread as well )

All I need to do now is find a 5” long moderator for the 35k and I’m sorted. ( so it’ll fit in the new gun bag without having to unscrew it )

Many thanks to all the contributors to the thread, and for all the good advice

Norm