Diana 45

[derekj]

I remember when the 'Original' 45 in .20 was one of the best bargains ever at around 70quid if I remember correctly. A lovely rifle let down by a nondescript stock that did nothing for correct eye scope alignment. It was however a popular FT rifle back in the day easily competing with FWB 124 and HW 80 and 35 rifles.

[Drew451]

The 45 was a big departure from other Diana's of the period and is very well designed and engineered as you rightly say, Dave. The 34 countered with a simple but effective design that makes good power. I've always thought a polyurethane piston sealed Original 45, resprung to suit, would edge the 34. As it stands, I think there's little or nothing in it.
I like the stock, particularly the earlier version. The butt is not markedly lower than other models with raised combs and I think the gun handles nicely. Perhaps it's not quite as handy as a 34 or 35 admittedly.
Its worth mentioning that Diana brought out a later 45 based on the 34 so presumably the model was missed by some.
Yes, if it was re-released, all syntheticed up, I would definitely buy one. It would be a costly rifle though, considering it's relative complexity. That's what killed it in the first place.

[Geezer]

The 45 was a big departure from other Diana's of the period and is very well designed and engineered as you rightly say, Dave. The 34 countered with a simple but effective design that makes good power. I've always thought a polyurethane piston sealed Original 45, resprung to suit, would edge the 34. As it stands, I think there's little or nothing in it.
I like the stock, particularly the earlier version. The butt is not markedly lower than other models with raised combs and I think the gun handles nicely. Perhaps it's not quite as handy as a 34 or 35 admittedly.
Its worth mentioning that Diana brought out a later 45 based on the 34 so presumably the model was missed by some.
Yes, if it was re-released, all syntheticed up, I would definitely buy one. It would be a costly rifle though, considering it's relative complexity. That's what killed it in the first place.

Agree, with three riders:

- official velocity figures (though who trusts them?) in the 80s put the 34 ahead on power;

- the later 45-based RWS45 and 34-based 45 were slightly desperate attempts to cash in on the 45 model name: neither was very successful;

- my personal theory on the 45 is that it sold very well from introduction until the HW80 arrived in 1980/1, then became very unfashionable. It was indeed a great FT choice in the early days.

And I have a feeling that on cost it would now be at least in the same league as a 97 or TX. Which means it would not sell (like the new FWB Sport).

[Drew451]

I'm with you on those counts although the leather washer would hinder the 45 a bit, but never by the 150 fps alleged by some American sources. I assume the 34 has slightly longer stroke.
The RWS version does provide a different shooting experience by virtue of its very different stock. Many would probably prefer it for use with a scope. Not many people found out though.
It is indeed unusual to see one dated after 82. Most are 79 to 81. The HW80 hurt it. I prefer the 45 though, despite having a lot of miles under my belt with both guns.

[jonnyone]

I'm with you on those counts although the leather washer would hinder the 45 a bit, but never by the 150 fps alleged by some American sources. I assume the 34 has slightly longer stroke.
The RWS version does provide a different shooting experience by virtue of its very different stock. Many would probably prefer it for use with a scope. Not many people found out though.
It is indeed unusual to see one dated after 82. Most are 79 to 81. The HW80 hurt it. I prefer the 45 though, despite having a lot of miles under my belt with both guns.

Yes I think the fact that Diana stuck with a leather piston head slightly bemused Walter in his airgun book. As you say if it had been fitted out with one from word go I think it would have certainly proved more efficient though not optimistically as much as some would argue. But perhaps certainly to a degree to reduce spring input somewhat and produce a nicer firing cycle.
Again a case of what could have been. But nowt to stop a project to convert over to a synthetic modern equivalent (especially heathens like myself who have no shame in not keeping things standard)

[landymick]

I'm with you on those counts although the leather washer would hinder the 45 a bit, but never by the 150 fps alleged by some American sources. I assume the 34 has slightly longer stroke.
The RWS version does provide a different shooting experience by virtue of its very different stock. Many would probably prefer it for use with a scope. Not many people found out though.
It is indeed unusual to see one dated after 82. Most are 79 to 81. The HW80 hurt it. I prefer the 45 though, despite having a lot of miles under my belt with both guns.

For me I prefer the HW80 if I had to choose between the pair & its not just for the Rekord trigger unit as the 45 unit is very nice when working correctly & the 45 stock is more usable than it looks.

Its the large plastic safety & the habit of the 45 to shear a portion of the pellet skirt (.22) that makes it second best for me.

[Geezer]

Yes I can't argue with much of what you have pointed out geezer. I think official and customer proven evidence pints to the 34 having higher power potential. Not quite sure which one wins on making that power smoother though. As we all know, more isn't necessarily best.
Ironically- and tjis is a purely personal perspective- I think that the RWS 45 was an.improvement over the rather bland 45, and in my book maybe it should have been the first format of the gun rather than.the last? Though its possible that the thinking there was to try and distinguish the 45 as an all new gun rather than a beefed up 35s which the RWS 45 shares a very similar stock to? And yes the stampede to.get the HW80 undoubtedly caused some sales damage to.the 45. But for those that didn't follow the herd I'm sure they continued to enjoy a very well engineered quality product.
It would be interesting to speculate as to what the price point would be of a 45 equivalent these days. And yes it may well be that Blighty could be overlooked if a 45 got re introduced in.the same way we are presently with the new FWB.

The RWS does indeed handle well and is more comfortable to shoot. John Walter said the opposite but I'm not with him on this now I have got my hands on the RWS, finally. There's a hint of match rifle about the RWS but obviously in a lighter package.
I find the safety is very handily placed on the 45's and its satisfying to click it off with the thumb. Yes, addictive rifles. And they can trade punches with just about any other standard springer.

For me I prefer the HW80 if I had to choose between the pair & its not just for the Rekord trigger unit as the 45 unit is very nice when working correctly & the 45 stock is more usable than it looks.

Its the large plastic safety & the habit of the 45 to shear a portion of the pellet skirt (.22) that makes it second best for me.

BTDT in SAR definitely rated the RWS45 in 1984 or so.

[Drew451]

BTDT in SAR definitely rated the RWS45 in 1984 or so.

Someone kindly pointed me towards that test recently and they did give it a huge thumbs up. I would also say that the quality of the review was a cut above most others I have read.
I was not a reader of the magazine as it was a bit before my time. Pity.

[jonnyone]

BTDT in SAR definitely rated the RWS45 in 1984 or so.

I picked mine up around the same time though more by default than design as some numpty had taken the leather head out of it and neglected to replace it- with anything as I later found out. They then passed it onto a second hand shop in town. The seething anger of the shop seller when I passed the gun back to him after it failed to push the pellet out of the barrel was disturbing! I think he would have bent the gun over the head of the guy who flogged it to him.
I simply helped the shop owner out by buying it at a suitable discount.
It still shoots well to this day
Yes I think I recall it was quite a potent weapon against the local squirrels if I remember right- much like my own-in both calibres

[Drew451]

For me I prefer the HW80 if I had to choose between the pair & its not just for the Rekord trigger unit as the 45 unit is very nice when working correctly & the 45 stock is more usable than it looks.

Its the large plastic safety & the habit of the 45 to shear a portion of the pellet skirt (.22) that makes it second best for me.

Yes, the angled breech face does take a bit of getting used to but I think I've adapted to it. Feels quite normal now.

[andrewM]

I have found this discussion most interesting.

I did not know a new FWB Sport had been introduced but, upon googling this, I then discovered that it appears only to have been exported to the USA market. The comments about the new Sport, on this forum - largely in 2014 - are critical of the new Sport and provide a poor impression of it. I had hopes, for a minute, that my desire to purchase a modern springer could be met by the new FWB Sport.

Back to the 45. My own was produced in 1980. In those days, the 45 was a tad under 12ft/lbs but some, I gather, were a little over. I cannot see how the 34 could have been more powerful - as some have suggested here - unless it was an FAC model. Mine seemed to perform best with Silver Jet pellets (in .177), with remarkable accuracy at 60 yds, albeit they did not produce the best power. I gather those pellets have long been discontinued.

I also had an FWB 127 but, if it came to it, I narrowly preferred the 45. I suspect the FWB obtained support from some because of its better looks. That said, the FWBs seem to obtain a considerable premium on the second hand market, perhaps because fewer were made.

I have never fired an HW80, so cannot compare and contrast. However, judging from the comments here, it seems the old 45 (produced, remarkably, nearly 40 years ago) is preferred by some to the new Diana break-barrels and, it seems, is not far away in quality and ability from the best of the modern HWs. I would certainly buy a new version, were one produced, but would it be up to the quality of the old 45? It would also be uneconomic to produce a new version, given the Diana 34 and 280 are in production.

I shall read further comments with interest.

Rgds to all
A

[jonnyone]

Agree, with three riders:

- official velocity figures (though who trusts them?) in the 80s put the 34 ahead on power;

- the later 45-based RWS45 and 34-based 45 were slightly desperate attempts to cash in on the 45 model name: neither was very successful;

- my personal theory on the 45 is that it sold very well from introduction until the HW80 arrived in 1980/1, then became very unfashionable. It was indeed a great FT choice in the early days.

And I have a feeling that on cost it would now be at least in the same league as a 97 or TX. Which means it would not sell (like the new FWB Sport).

Yes I can't argue with much of what you have pointed out geezer. I think official and customer proven evidence pints to the 34 having higher power potential. Not quite sure which one wins on making that power smoother though. As we all know, more isn't necessarily best.
Ironically- and tjis is a purely personal perspective- I think that the RWS 45 was an.improvement over the rather bland 45, and in my book maybe it should have been the first format of the gun rather than.the last? Though its possible that the thinking there was to try and distinguish the 45 as an all new gun rather than a beefed up 35s which the RWS 45 shares a very similar stock to? And yes the stampede to.get the HW80 undoubtedly caused some sales damage to.the 45. But for those that didn't follow the herd I'm sure they continued to enjoy a very well engineered quality product.
It would be interesting to speculate as to what the price point would be of a 45 equivalent these days. And yes it may well be that Blighty could be overlooked if a 45 got re introduced in.the same way we are presently with the new FWB.

[Drew451]

Yes I can't argue with much of what you have pointed out geezer. I think official and customer proven evidence pints to the 34 having higher power potential. Not quite sure which one wins on making that power smoother though. As we all know, more isn't necessarily best.
Ironically- and tjis is a purely personal perspective- I think that the RWS 45 was an.improvement over the rather bland 45, and in my book maybe it should have been the first format of the gun rather than.the last? Though its possible that the thinking there was to try and distinguish the 45 as an all new gun rather than a beefed up 35s which the RWS 45 shares a very similar stock to? And yes the stampede to.get the HW80 undoubtedly caused some sales damage to.the 45. But for those that didn't follow the herd I'm sure they continued to enjoy a very well engineered quality product.
It would be interesting to speculate as to what the price point would be of a 45 equivalent these days. And yes it may well be that Blighty could be overlooked if a 45 got re introduced in.the same way we are presently with the new FWB.

In theory the RWS type could have been the first format of the gun as the 35 Super preceded the 45. Except no one thought of it at time. It did give the 45 a new lease of life in the twilight of its run. I find it surprising that the Original 45 ran on till '88. Presumably, they were still quite popular in some countries if not fashion conscious Britain.

[jonnyone]

The 45 was a big departure from other Diana's of the period and is very well designed and engineered as you rightly say, Dave. The 34 countered with a simple but effective design that makes good power. I've always thought a polyurethane piston sealed Original 45, resprung to suit, would edge the 34. As it stands, I think there's little or nothing in it.
I like the stock, particularly the earlier version. The butt is not markedly lower than other models with raised combs and I think the gun handles nicely. Perhaps it's not quite as handy as a 34 or 35 admittedly.
Its worth mentioning that Diana brought out a later 45 based on the 34 so presumably the model was missed by some.
Yes, if it was re-released, all syntheticed up, I would definitely buy one. It would be a costly rifle though, considering it's relative complexity. That's what killed it in the first place.

Very very true. And I think that the gun exemplifies the effort Diana put into the project to bring out a gun that could compete with the FWB.and the 80. True, the 80 would more than edge it at the higher US power levels but as many will attest ut could compete quite favourably with other top.of the range German guns of the day.
I think in engineering terms the 45 was something of a high water mark for Diana in its break barrel efforts. And yet as you say it was also perhaps its undoing.
Maybe that's the bottom line, to produce it again at a standard demanded by the public would make it cost ineffective.

[jonnyone]

I remember when the 'Original' 45 in .20 was one of the best bargains ever at around 70quid if I remember correctly. A lovely rifle let down by a nondescript stock that did nothing for correct eye scope alignment. It was however a popular FT rifle back in the day easily competing with FWB 124 and HW 80 and 35 rifles.

I agree. And whilst still not perfect the RWS variant with its cheekpiece and pressed checkering went at least some way to.improving looks and handling.
Dave