HFT too 'clean'?

[LittleChief]

Hi

Im new to the forum so hello to all, and i hope im not treading on any toes but i was wondering about something.

I shot rounds 2 & 3 of the UKAHFT at Tawd and Rivi and both were excellent, i mean seriously good. The effort that was put in was brilliant and you could tell people really appreciated the courses.

Over the 2 days i heard alot of chatter about things things being 'in the way', to my mind HFT is supposed to simulate hunting scenarios (to me this is one of the main differences between FT and HFT) and in real life humps, bumps, shrubbery, and foliage to get in the way but it seems the powers that be dont like that. They seem intent on all targets being clean and direct from the peg. I dont see the problem with having to find the best shot and then find a way of touching the peg, instead on 99% of shots you could snuggle up to the peg.

My question is this, what do you think of the challenge of HFT, not just the shooters ability to hit the target but to find a way to see past obstacles, to 'find' the best shot. At Rivi there were a few shots near the top (2, 3 & 4 i think) that had a hump in the way, so you had to contort to make the shot and the sense of satifaction for a 'kill' was huge.

The same goes for foliage, the course managers insisted that nothing hung in the eyeline (not line of shot) that could 'put someone off' which seems a bit artificial, as out in the real world things do get in the way so finding the shot, and making the kill offer enormous rewards.

Sorry it was wordy but i was just wondering what you think.

[jinx]

The trouble is, stuff 'in the way' gets shot 'out of the way' making it easier if you come to that target later on. The courses are designed in such a way that the shot is the same for the last shooter as it was for the first. Also, it is taken into account that there are shooters of all sizes and abilities on the course and again, it needs to be acheivable by all shooters.

[mintyrn10]

hft should be a hunting scenario comeing across quary in the field and shooting it accurately before it pissis off not ,,, hang on bunny just let me lay down and if you dont mined moveing that piece of grass or stick so i can shoot you i dont do to much hft for that reason and if i do its kneeling and standing only not prone

[I. J.]

Personally, I feel as long as the target has a visible kill zone, whatever the size, and is the exact same (discounting weather variances) for the first competitor as it is for the last then that target is OK by me. Its a target sport not an eye sight test.
If shorties, notice I didn't say Juniors as most tower above me, have difficulty seeing a standing target a removable platform (small pallet etc.) could be used. If you can stand and see all the kill zone or go prone and see a fraction - its make your mind up time. Similarly if you remain at the peg 'mono-podding' and see part of the kill or move into a more unfriendly position, while still touching the peg, and see all of it thats up to you.

The humps in the ground at the Rivvi shoot on target 3 & 4 caught a few out.

ATB
Ian

[poison dwarf]

It will be in open fields or even on tarmac soon, in case any foliage or leaf falling from a tree enters your line of site and puts you off.
For most shooters its for the fun of it but for a select few its all about getting that perfect score

[Alegazmoz]

The trouble is, stuff 'in the way' gets shot 'out of the way' making it easier if you come to that target later on. The courses are designed in such a way that the shot is the same for the last shooter as it was for the first. Also, it is taken into account that there are shooters of all sizes and abilities on the course and again, it needs to be acheivable by all shooters.

Additionally Mark, you forgot to mention that it's a sport.
A sport with rules, that make it all inclusive & fun for everyone, regardless of age, gender, ability and as some have proved, disability.
A derivation of formal field target shooting, it does not simulate or replicate the hunting act, but rather incorporates aspects of hunting to make the sport more entertaining and appealing to a broader base of shooter.
Everyone seems to have a 'take' on how they feel the sport of HFT should be run. Fortunately, the sport of HFT is adequately catered for by a set of rules created to make it all encompassing, for shooters, equipment and venues.
The rules are there on the UKAHFT web site, for those who have a genuine desire to take up the sport, 'warts 'n' all'
With regard say to game of Backgammon, could any criticism of the game be taken seriously, from anyone lacking the knowledge, or experience of the rules and strategies, necessary to qualify such crticism.
As a novice, I know the OP was merely voicing on opinion and you in turn were expanding on his enquiry.
HFT should be taken 'as is'
If it suits, take it up, learn the rules and enjoy it for what it is. If not, take up something else.
See you on the circuit 'champ'
Rule 7 roolz!
arf!

[Kingplinker]

At a recent HFT shoot the only way to see a target for the majority of shooters was to lay down with legs akimbo with meat and two veg wedged in tight against a tree. If you think that was bad , at nob height ( approx 9 inches in my case ) were a stack of stinging nettles eager to bypass my clothing and attack my veg with every sudden movement I made !

Now all that is before I put a pellet in my gun and once in position and getting my first sight of the target I find its placed in between opposing trees at different distances and the area in front of my barrel was like trying to look through Bil Oddie's beard !!!

My nob hurt , my neck hurt , my back hurt and I don't like Bill Oddie but nevertheless I lined my shot up and down went the target .... hey presto , big smile - I dust myself down and find some medicinal leaves and its on to the next target .

Regardless of our moans and groans the majority will shoot again next week and I guarantee something will pi$$ them off but also make them smile .

Welcome to Hunter Field Target , enjoy

Dave

[ChrisC]

I was at both tawd and Rivi and i didn't hear any complaints. And if i had i would have said that i didn't see any problems on both courses. Not once did i have foilage obstructing my line of sight. the only thing i can think about was maybe the grass humps at Rivi but that was a deliberate ploy by the course setters to make you think about the target. When shooting the lane in front you look towards a 25yd 25mm kill target and think great a "gimme" , then you lay down to see that the target placement is nigh on perfect and forces you high onto the elbows to clear the hump, this in turn makes the target that little bit harder (ask Ross H).

The problem is people plop down, grab the peg and shoot without thinking and then slag off the lane when they get a doughnut. I've done it myself and learnt from it over the years to check your pellets path by eye first then through the scope. If you suspect there may be something in the way move your head away from the scope to change the eye relief, this will let you see closer obstructions....bottom line, take your time (but not more than 2 minutes)

i think the reason people complain about this sort of thing is because it throws an element of luck into the pot and negates the skill, imagine if you were clear and on the last lane clipped a bit of grass for a doughnut???..result, seriously unhappy bunny. In my opinion HFT is 80% homework/skill, 10% kit and 10% luck.

although it is called Hunter field target it is still a target sport and has it's own rules. Know the rules and stick to them and all will be well. If HFT is not your thing then fair enough but don't sneer at someone when they don't sit down on the beanbag. Each sport has it's own skill set and whilst similar in some aspects is very different in others. i really like to see the cross over between disciplines, the HFT worlds had some very well respected FT shooters come along for the weekend and i myself will be dusting down my FT rig for the NEFTA winter league.

[Feral]

At a recent HFT shoot the only way to see a target for the majority of shooters was to lay down with legs akimbo with meat and two veg wedged in tight against a tree.

The crotch tickler was a particularly nasty one to get comfy on Dave, glad it's not just me that ended up with nettle rash on the tackle! Also the wobbly tree shot... who needs obstructions in the lane when you are shooting off of a writhing octopus tentacle!

There are plenty of ways the course setters make the courses as interesting and challenging for the first person to shoot the peg as the last without relying on bits of cabbage in the way that soon disappear.

LittleChief wait until you have some more shoots under your belt you'll find plenty of targets that have your teeth gnashing!... come to Buxted on a club day and you'll see but beware rule 7

[Enthusiast]

Lots of good responses to this one chaps.

To the above I would add that some of the shots in HFT would NOT be suitable shots to take in a hunting situation, because they are too hard.

HFT sets targets out to 45 yards - how would you take a 45 yarder when hunting(if at all?)would you really take a 45 yarder standing in the field? I suspect not - if you were to take a shot like that you would have to be very stable, dead sure of your ability etc etc. Standers in HFT are at a maximum of 35 yards - believe me in a competition situation more competitiors miss these than hit them. Meaning that it should not be a shot taken when hunting by most people.

In HFT you take a shot like that knowing that at worst you don't score two points, so you can stretch your ability - unlike hunting where you should be sure of every shot.

ie - it isn't hunting simulation but a target sport with elements of hunting in it - as my wise friends above have already stated.

Having said that, if you want to take all the shots standing and kneeling, there are only 3 forced prone shots...

Get in there and enjoy it!

Richard

[Nocity]

The humps in the ground at the Rivvi shoot on target 3 & 4 caught a few out.

ATB
Ian

Including one who should have known better!!!

[steveRS]

At a recent HFT shoot the only way to see a target for the majority of shooters was to lay down with legs akimbo with meat and two veg wedged in tight against a tree. If you think that was bad , at nob height ( approx 9 inches in my case ) were a stack of stinging nettles eager to bypass my clothing and attack my veg with every sudden movement I made !

Now all that is before I put a pellet in my gun and once in position and getting my first sight of the target I find its placed in between opposing trees at different distances and the area in front of my barrel was like trying to look through Bil Oddie's beard !!!

My nob hurt , my neck hurt , my back hurt and I don't like Bill Oddie but nevertheless I lined my shot up and down went the target .... hey presto , big smile - I dust myself down and find some medicinal leaves and its on to the next target .

Regardless of our moans and groans the majority will shoot again next week and I guarantee something will pi$$ them off but also make them smile .

Welcome to Hunter Field Target , enjoy

Dave

PMSL.......

This so far is a perfect take on HFT....

[I. J.]

Including one who should have known better!!!

Plus ROSSH. Mind you this is the HFT shooter who couldn't find the door into the PortaLoo !!! I jest not.

Very interesting comments above. I think it has been said previously the only reason the word 'Hunter' is used in the term HFT is to differentiate it from Field Target.

On the subject of disability. A fine line has to be drawn between catering for the disabled shooter and setting up an interesting course. While our club does cater for the disabled our targets are positioned so that, say a compulsory kneeler cant be shot from the required position it is capable of being seen from the next hardest stance, in this example standing. While this does give them a slight disadvantage life has already given them the shiiiity end of the stick.

ATB
Ian

[jinx]

Additionally Mark, you forgot to mention that it's a sport.
A sport with rules, that make it all inclusive & fun for everyone, regardless of age, gender, ability and as some have proved, disability.
A derivation of formal field target shooting, it does not simulate or replicate the hunting act, but rather incorporates aspects of hunting to make the sport more entertaining and appealing to a broader base of shooter.
Everyone seems to have a 'take' on how they feel the sport of HFT should be run. Fortunately, the sport of HFT is adequately catered for by a set of rules created to make it all encompassing, for shooters, equipment and venues.
The rules are there on the UKAHFT web site, for those who have a genuine desire to take up the sport, 'warts 'n' all'
With regard say to game of Backgammon, could any criticism of the game be taken seriously, from anyone lacking the knowledge, or experience of the rules and strategies, necessary to qualify such crticism.
As a novice, I know the OP was merely voicing on opinion and you in turn were expanding on his enquiry.
HFT should be taken 'as is'
If it suits, take it up, learn the rules and enjoy it for what it is. If not, take up something else.
See you on the circuit 'champ'
Rule 7 roolz!
arf!

That is pretty much spot on, Gary and is more or less what i had in mind when i replied last night, but having spent the day replacing the clutch and an engine mount on the Shepreth BattleBus (Colin's Blue Sherpa) which fought me every step, i was a bit too knackered to get it typed out like that.

[D Martin]

Quite right as others have said, HFT is a target sport with rules.
If you want to hunt then go out and hunt without the rules but just remember one thing.....if there is a branch or large amount of foliage infront of you should you really be taking that shot ?
You may not get the clean kill that you want so in a way making HFT "clean"is giving you good disaplin for hunting.
I enjoy HFT, the social side as much as the shooting and will carry on doing it for as long as I can no matter what rule changes are fetched in.

Dave