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Thread: Fas 6004 v 604

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by candleman View Post
    No it didn't
    Stop lying.
    No one throws an item they paid hundreds of pounds for in the bin.
    Now you're just making stuff up and I don't believe you ever owned one.
    Ok then, not all in the bin, I did sell some bits.

    http://www.airgunbbs.com/showthread....highlight=6004

    But the rest went in the bin. So there You need to back up calling someone a liar with some provable fact, your opinion doesn't matter.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhatMan View Post
    Hello to All,

    Some fixes/improvements for the Chiappa 6004 :

    http://www.targettalk.org/viewtopic.php?t=53523

    Have fun & a good Sunday

    Best regards

    Russ
    That is a good link Russ - many thanks.
    Rossendale Model Target Club every Tuesday and Thursday evening 7 - 10pm.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucieboy View Post
    Ok then, not all in the bin, I did sell some bits.

    http://www.airgunbbs.com/showthread....highlight=6004

    But the rest went in the bin. So there You need to back up calling someone a liar with some provable fact, your opinion doesn't matter.
    Hi Brucieboy,

    Thanks for providing the proof to "candleman" that you did own a 6004 (it was not necessary) and for showing us how much of it of any value was left after you decided to bin the rest of it.

    Forty quid is not a lot of cash to have left after selling anything that could be sold. If you had years of good shooting with it and put many thousands of pellets through it I would still hope that it had a little more value left in it and that any worn or broken parts could be replaced.

    Binning a modern target air pistol is almost unheard of. Target pistols usually have an easy life, are seldom taken outdoors to get wet or muddy, and are usually kept clean and very well cared for.

    Was there nothing you could do to repair it or find a good gunsmith that could fix it for you?

    Your experience is another of the many bad ownership experiences that worries me enough not to buy a new one at this moment. If they ever get the problems fixed it would be a really nice SSP for use at 10 meters or in the 6 yard MPL competitions.

    I gave my son my last 604 mk2 several years ago and for me the 6004 would have been the ideal replacement - and it still may be, as no manufacturer can afford to ignore the feedback they must have been receiving from their importers/distributor/dealer network and customers since they started their new business, and hopefully they will respond by making the changes it needs and their customers deserve.

    Sorry your 6004 experience ended so badly for you - but I am still hopeful that a mk2 may come along and that it will be made from a harder alloy and have all the known faults taken care of.

    Stay safe!
    Rossendale Model Target Club every Tuesday and Thursday evening 7 - 10pm.

  4. #34
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    I didn't buy it new and as it needed a new over-lever, the availability, if any, of which and cost would be prohibitive I imagine would be near what I paid for it. Looking online I've seen examples of the over-lever cracking with cocking
    I'd lost confidence in it so it had to go. When you think they actually cost half as much as the old 604 allowing for inflation I suppose you shouldn't really expect them to be as good, but then again you don't expect them to be so fragile either. I did like the look of it and how it handled though,
    It needs an improved alloy for the over-lever, thicker bolts for fastenings and a closer inspection of the finished article for fit and finish. Many won't even sight in for 10 metres, they shoot high, the elevation screw springs get coil bound. A change of springs cures it but it shouldn't be like that.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucieboy View Post
    I didn't buy it new and as it needed a new over-lever, the availability, if any, of which and cost would be prohibitive I imagine would be near what I paid for it. Looking online I've seen examples of the over-lever cracking with cocking
    I'd lost confidence in it so it had to go. When you think they actually cost half as much as the old 604 allowing for inflation I suppose you shouldn't really expect them to be as good, but then again you don't expect them to be so fragile either. I did like the look of it and how it handled though,
    It needs an improved alloy for the over-lever, thicker bolts for fastenings and a closer inspection of the finished article for fit and finish. Many won't even sight in for 10 metres, they shoot high, the elevation screw springs get coil bound. A change of springs cures it but it shouldn't be like that.
    Thanks Brucie,

    That answers all my questions, and your final summary of what you think could be improved can be backed-up by the comments of many others, although I had not heard about the over-lever cracking before - but to be honest I had stopped looking as I was hoping for a mk2 to arrive with all the problems addressed by now.

    You make a good valid point about the price though, if it works out to be anywhere near being only half the price of the original 604 (allowing for inflation) it is a remarkable product for the money. The anatomical grip in particular is a belter. The one I borrowed fitted me a treat, and like you I too liked the look and the feel of the pistol......and is why I would still like to own one!

    There must be room for Chiappa to fix the weak areas and charge a higher price so we end up with pistol that is as durable as the old 604 (maybe better if the barrel casing does not crack like some of the 604 pistols did when they were dropped) and it is certainly better looking (IMHO).

    Stay safe!
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  6. #36
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    I have owned a Mk1 FAS 604 bought new when they first came out, I passed it on to a relative when I bought the Mk2 also new, which I still have, he still has the Mk1 to this day, and with close to 40 years of use, has performed faultlessly as has the Mk2 which I still have.

    I have seen several 6004's when coaching, and have personally witnessed faults and poor build quality on several, in my view having owned the 604 and seen firts hand problems with the 6004, it is clear to me that they are not built to the same standards as the 604. In 40 years, and having seen many 604's I have never seen a broken frame, that of course does not mean that it has not happened in isolated incidents, and also that the failures of the 6004 may also be isolated.

    I will point out that when I bought my original 604 Mk1 new, that it was manufactured by a company that produced top level .22rf firearms, was genuinely hand finished, it was state of the art when originally built, and that the price was similar with other top line pistols of its day. I changed from a FWB 65, I shot Internationally with my 65 and my FAS, and shot identical PB match scores of 384 ex 400 with both (yes it was 40 shot days then!). I know the Mk 2, later in 1989 cost 385 and that was a comparable cost to other top line pistols. FAS brought out their then new 606 around '89 which cost over 500 around that time.

    The 6004 is now a 40 year old design, lets be realistic, it is not state of the art now even for a SSP, and it was considerably surpassed later by some superb SSP's, but it still costs under 500 now, some 30 years later, that's less than the top level classic SSPs of the 80's/90's are fetching now!

    That makes it a good value budget match air pistol irrespective of its failings. State of the art Match air pistols now are 2000. See the 6004 for what it is, a good value budget match air pistol!

    Zooma is spot on, what is not acceptable in this thread is the offensive language, and insulting attitudes, of some posters, that is a total disgrace, things, and language I have never seen on this forum before, I would say to those people, that others are entitled to their view, right or wrong, you may disagree, but you may not insult, so they need to apologise unreservedly, or never stain this site with their presence again.

    Have Fun
    Robin
    Walther KK500 expert special - Barnard .223 "wilde" custom alloy Dolphin stock (but with Walther grip and wood!). - Keppeler 6 mmBR with Walther grip and wood! I may be a Walther-phile?

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobinC View Post

    Zooma is spot on, what is not acceptable in this thread is the offensive language, and insulting attitudes, of some posters, that is a total disgrace, things, and language I have never seen on this forum before, I would say to those people, that others are entitled to their view, right or wrong, you may disagree, but you may not insult, so they need to apologise unreservedly, or never stain this site with their presence again.

    Have Fun
    Robin

    Exactly !
    I resisted (nearly) further commenting on this thread, but kept watching, when certain members started insulting and name calling. For Bob (ZOOMA) Mike (MIKEC4) and I to do so is expected because its done with the greatest respect for each other and our years of experience with 10m pistols. I feel certain members posting on this thread should be posting an apology.
    Last edited by I. J.; 26-04-2021 at 06:59 PM.

  8. #38
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    I'm not saying all my targets look like this but I just finished my practice session tonight on a five shot high.
    10 meters single freehand.
    I certainly don't think the pistol is lacking in the accuracy department


  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyals View Post
    I'm not saying all my targets look like this but I just finished my practice session tonight on a five shot high.
    10 meters single freehand.
    I certainly don't think the pistol is lacking in the accuracy department

    Just think what you could do with a decent pistol !

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyals View Post
    I'm not saying all my targets look like this but I just finished my practice session tonight on a five shot high.
    10 meters single freehand.
    I certainly don't think the pistol is lacking in the accuracy department

    Excellent single handed shooting at 10 metres!
    Last edited by zooma; 03-05-2021 at 04:03 PM.
    Rossendale Model Target Club every Tuesday and Thursday evening 7 - 10pm.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucieboy View Post
    I didn't buy it new and as it needed a new over-lever, the availability, if any, of which and cost would be prohibitive I imagine would be near what I paid for it. Looking online I've seen examples of the over-lever cracking with cocking
    I'd lost confidence in it so it had to go. When you think they actually cost half as much as the old 604 allowing for inflation I suppose you shouldn't really expect them to be as good, but then again you don't expect them to be so fragile either. I did like the look of it and how it handled though,
    It needs an improved alloy for the over-lever, thicker bolts for fastenings and a closer inspection of the finished article for fit and finish. Many won't even sight in for 10 metres, they shoot high, the elevation screw springs get coil bound. A change of springs cures it but it shouldn't be like that.

    The cracking issue was a problem with the 604, which is being described as the better pistol and not the 6004.
    The latter addresses this with a slightly different design as was earlier pointed out.
    So it was a 604 that went into the bin and not the "inferior" 6004.
    Glad that's cleared up.

    http://www.airgunbbs.com/showthread....ing-For-Spares

    Last edited by andyals; 21-05-2021 at 09:18 PM.

  12. #42
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    My original post #18 makes no mention of a cracking top strap, and yes, it was a 6004 that was consigned to the bin.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucieboy View Post
    I've seen examples of the over-lever cracking with cocking
    Again
    This was an issue with the 604 AND NOT the 6004.
    The latter had a change of design in this area to make it stronger.

  14. #44
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    Hello to All,

    The is a video here by 'TenMetrePeter' on fixing a crack on the FAS 604 top strap ( quite why it is age protected I do not know ) :

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tiF2_rNeWUU

    And seal replacement :

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlGQbR0iUAU

    Have fun & a good weekend

    Best regards

    Russ

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyals View Post
    Again
    This was an issue with the 604 AND NOT the 6004.
    The latter had a change of design in this area to make it stronger.
    The 6004 appears to be made of a more malleable (softer) alloy than the old 604, and this together with the new radius on the cocking lever/barrel shroud should make it a lot less prone to a fracture in this area than the old 604 was if it should be dropped.

    We will have to wait a few more years yet to see if the 6004 castings harden and embrittle with age (as some alloy castings do) but the barrel shroud does still have that radius to protect it and being softer to start with they may well stay more malleable over the years and remain more resistant to impact fracture than the old 604 castings.

    Also, being a current production model, a replacement barrel shroud casting would presumably be available if one were ever needed?

    The vast majority of 604 (Mk 1 and Mk 2 versions) are "getting on" a bit now, but they have survived and are mostly still working well, but has anyone looked to see if the 6004 barrel shroud will fit the 604 to make a suitable replacement for the few that have cracked?

    If the 6004 barrel shroud will fit the early (FAS made) 604 air pistols this would be an ideal scenario as even the odd few that have been dropped and suffered a fractured barrel shroud could be saved.
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