16mm acrylic foresight elements

[Graemevw]

Anyone know where I can get these? I can only find 18mm and 22mm.
I know they exist, as I have 1, but I need more sizes and have 2 rifles I want to use them in.

[harvey_s]

I can make you these - PM incoming

[PhatMan]

Graemevw,

+1 on harvey_s' elements

Have fun

Best regards

Russ

[Graemevw]

Rather than start another post, I have another question I might as well tack on here.

I'm shooting bell target and 6 yard nsra rifle paper targets.
I have one foresight element and it's 3.1mm.

I need a bigger one really for the paper targets but I'm inexperienced so am going to have to just take a stab at guessing what sizes would be good.
Can anyone give me a ballpark idea?

With the bell target I thought I needed to go smaller as I'm not very good at judging when it's central.
Everyone I've asked though says not to go smaller and 3.1mm is pretty small already.
It just occurred to me that I might be making assumptions in the wrong direction.
Would going bigger help?

The rear iris is quite small too, about 1mm, but cemtering the front right in the iris isn't the problem I don't think.

I'm new to diopter sights and I don't seem to be very good with them yet.

I had thought about trying 2.8mm for bell target and maybe 4.5mm for the nsra paper targets but now I'm wondering if I should go up, maybe to 3.5mm for bell and then maybe go even bigger than 4.5mm for paper.

I'm completely guessing though.
I'll order a few, but I need to be in the right sort of range otherwise I'll have to order 25 of them!

Thanks.

[Rutty]

A few basics, too large a foresight is worse than the best size, but too small a one is a serious disadvantage. The aiming mark must be contained within the foresight ring, if it wobbles out of it when you’re aiming, you need a larger foresight.

You say:

With the bell target I thought I needed to go smaller as I'm not very good at judging when it's central.

That seems to indicate that you might be watching the aiming mark? The aiming mark doesn’t move (believe it or not), it’s the foresight you must keep in focus and concentrate on. A nice well defined ring of reasonable thickness helps, not a thin one. When you look through the sights the foresight must be the thing that attracts your focus, not the aiming mark.

Now for the difficult bit, size. Everyone’s eyes are different and that can lead some variation in what people perceive as their ideal foresight diameter. Try not to buy a handful, as you will end up using just two or three. Most clubs have a few in a drawer somewhere and many shooters have a few spare that you might ask to borrow. Have a go with 4.8 at 10m and see how you get on. If it’s ok, then look for a size that gives a similar sight picture at 6yds. You have to find what’s best for you. As you progress and reduce your movement, you may find that you are able to drop a size.

Rear sight aperture of 1.0mm is ok, depending upon your distance from the sight. As a guide, the “normal “ range with an eye relief of 2-3cm is 1.0-1.2mm.

Hope this helps,
Rutty

[Graemevw]

A few basics, too large a foresight is worse than the best size, but too small a one is a serious disadvantage. The aiming mark must be contained within the foresight ring, if it wobbles out of it when you’re aiming, you need a larger foresight.

You say:



That seems to indicate that you might be watching the aiming mark? The aiming mark doesn’t move (believe it or not), it’s the foresight you must keep in focus and concentrate on. A nice well defined ring of reasonable thickness helps, not a thin one. When you look through the sights the foresight must be the thing that attracts your focus, not the aiming mark.

Now for the difficult bit, size. Everyone’s eyes are different and that can lead some variation in what people perceive as their ideal foresight diameter. Try not to buy a handful, as you will end up using just two or three. Most clubs have a few in a drawer somewhere and many shooters have a few spare that you might ask to borrow. Have a go with 4.8 at 10m and see how you get on. If it’s ok, then look for a size that gives a similar sight picture at 6yds. You have to find what’s best for you. As you progress and reduce your movement, you may find that you are able to drop a size.

Rear sight aperture of 1.0mm is ok, depending upon your distance from the sight. As a guide, the “normal “ range with an eye relief of 2-3cm is 1.0-1.2mm.

Hope this helps,
Rutty

Thank you, that's very helpful.
I shot alot better this evening. I was alot calmer which helped. I was far steadier than I've been the last two weeks. Steadier even than I normally am at home.
I think I probably need to shoot more to be able to judge sizes.

The rear iris is quite small on my gun but then the front sight is 16mm so the sizes work well together.

I did have a go with a 300s tonight with a 2mm front element and it's unshootable for me! I can get my aim, and could probably use it, but it makes the sight picture so cloudy it's hard to actually see the aim point!
I also had a go with another 300s that had a 3mm front element and a rear iris of 0.9, smaller than mine, and I found the rear iris too small really.

As im still moving alot on the shot i am struggling to judge when the aim point is central. With a smaller hole it seems easier to catch the right moment to take the shot as it's quicker to determine if I'm on aim or not.
I'm still basically at the stage of wobbling all over the place and taking the shot at the brief moment everything lines up.

I think at the moment I swap and change whether I'm looking at the aim mark or the front sight. Probably swap back and forth while aiming too. I hadn't yet worked out for myself what way worked best. If I'm supposed to just be watching the front sight I'll start only doing that from now on.

It's quite a learning curve but I was very pleased with most of my shooting today. I need to tighten up a bit more but I'm not all over the place anymore. With 6 shots I'm currently shooting 4 into a tight clover leaf, one with maybe 3/4 of the hole outside the clover leaf and maybe one just outside that grouping. I am generally still to the right though so might also need a little windage adjustment.

[PhatMan]

Graemevw,

I use a 4.6 mm foresight aperture for 6 yard & 10m shooting.

For me, the larger aperture works fine for shooting standing and unsupported.

I would suggest trying : 3.8mm, 4.2mm, and 4.6mm

and see how you like each one - that will guide you towards what is best for you.

Have fun

Best regards

Russ

[Graemevw]

Graemevw,

I use a 4.6 mm foresight aperture for 6 yard & 10m shooting.

For me, the larger aperture works fine for shooting standing and unsupported.

I would suggest trying : 3.8mm, 4.2mm, and 4.6mm

and see how you like each one - that will guide you towards what is best for you.

Have fun

Best regards

Russ

Thanks. I've not tried 10m. I was looking at the targets online yesterday. When aiming, do the black areas of the nsra 6 yard 5 and 10m 5, look about the same? I assume so if your using the same element.
4.6mm is about what I guessed for these targets.

[PhatMan]

Graemevw,

Yup - the 6 yard targets @ 6 yards, and the 10 m targets @ 10m, show about the same visual size through the sights.

10 m aiming mark is 30.5mm.

6 yard aiming mark is 16 mm, scaled to 10 m would be 29.6 mm, so about the same apparent size as the 10 m target @ 10 m ( 29.6 mm vs. 30.5 mm)

Have fun

regards

Russ

[Graemevw]

Graemevw,

Yup - the 6 yard targets @ 6 yards, and the 10 m targets @ 10m, show about the same visual size through the sights.

10 m aiming mark is 30.5mm.

6 yard aiming mark is 16 mm, scaled to 10 m would be 29.6 mm, so about the same apparent size as the 10 m target @ 10 m ( 29.6 mm vs. 30.5 mm)

Have fun

regards

Russ

Thanks, I thought that might be the case.
I've ordered some 10m targets too, see how a fair at the longer distance.