Bsa sight frozen solid

[thisisdonald]

ive had luck with 'Eds Red'. You can make a batch of this up and store it in a glass bottle with plastic lid - Ive still got some I made years ago

https://www.vkhgc.ca/documents/Ed%20gun%20cleaner.pdf

[trajectory]

ive had luck with 'Eds Red'. You can make a batch of this up and store it in a glass bottle with plastic lid - Ive still got some I made years ago

https://www.vkhgc.ca/documents/Ed%20gun%20cleaner.pdf

Thank you for that, looks like a useful concoction!

[Kuyajonathan]

Quite lot of good advice mentioned,

Diesel in a 'ban Marie'...... Well diesel soaking is good, heats good, so I guess it figures hot diesel might be better.
The heat transferred through the diesel will expand the parts in question, aiding penetration, dry heat could affect blueing.
Personally used penetrant dye to remove a stubborn broken cylinder head stud on a then 20 yr old BLMC A' series engine, mole grips etc were no effect, didn't want to shear off what remained even further. Small ring of plasticine to hold fluid round stud forming reservoir, left over night- result. This tip from Rolls Royce Aero engineer neighbour.

[edbear2]

Quite lot of good advice mentioned,

Diesel in a 'ban Marie'...... Well diesel soaking is good, heats good, so I guess it figures hot diesel might be better.
The heat transferred through the diesel will expand the parts in question, aiding penetration, dry heat could affect blueing.
Personally used penetrant dye to remove a stubborn broken cylinder head stud on a then 20 yr old BLMC A' series engine, mole grips etc were no effect, didn't want to shear off what remained even further. Small ring of plasticine to hold fluid round stud forming reservoir, left over night- result. This tip from Rolls Royce Aero engineer neighbour.

It's a common trick on gas turbines, where the materials used and heat cycles lend themselves to fretting and getting stuck unless great care is taken when removing, one of my regular jobs for the last 10 years has been removing inconel / hastelloy / various high tensile material studs that have snapped by engineers during being rotated through shop.

It's great stuff, however take care as it gets everywhere, will go though several layers of clothing in an instant and dye your hands and nails red in a flash, so gloves and care.

It washes away with most solvents, but it's "creep" is amazing if you have never used it, it will go though an inch of a casting which has the tightest hairline crack, or travel down an inch of thread of something bolted together, in effect doing it's job.

Not even expensive, at less than a can of spraypaint at Halfords!

ATB, ED

[trajectory]

It's a common trick on gas turbines, where the materials used and heat cycles lend themselves to fretting and getting stuck unless great care is taken when removing, one of my regular jobs for the last 10 years has been removing inconel / hastaloy / various high tensile material studs that have snapped by engineers during being rotated through shop.

It's great stuff, however take care as it gets everywhere, will go though several layers of clothing in an instant and dye your hands and nails red in a flash, so gloves and care.

It washes away with most solvents, but it's "creep" is amazing if you have never used it, it will go though an inch of a casting which has the tightest hairline crack, or travel down an inch of thread of something bolted together, in effect doing it's job.

Not even expensive, at less than a can of spraypaint at Halfords!

ATB, ED

This penetrant dye sounds like its usefull stuff. I've never used it before but I have heard of it, but just for fault detection, not as an aid to dismantling seized components. So, I think it's time to go & find some but in the meantime heat & soak cycles will remain the order of the day. If it frees up before the dye arrives I won't mind, just want it in bits,
Thanks all

[trajectory]

edbear2

Just sent you a pm

[Kuyajonathan]

It's a common trick on gas turbines, where the materials used and heat cycles lend themselves to fretting and getting stuck unless great care is taken when removing, one of my regular jobs for the last 10 years has been removing inconel / hastaloy / various high tensile material studs that have snapped by engineers during being rotated through shop.

It's great stuff, however take care as it gets everywhere, will go though several layers of clothing in an instant and dye your hands and nails red in a flash, so gloves and care.

It washes away with most solvents, but it's "creep" is amazing if you have never used it, it will go though an inch of a casting which has the tightest hairline crack, or travel down an inch of thread of something bolted together, in effect doing it's job.

Not even expensive, at less than a can of spraypaint at Halfords!

ATB, ED

neighbour who gave me some for the stuck stud said they used it at Rolls Royce to check vanes etc in the jet engines for casting cracks as well as when servicing- refurbing for stress,fatigue, bird strike damage etc edbear echoes what he said penetrating through castings, threaded items & so on

[edbear2]

This penetrant dye sounds like its usefull stuff. I've never used it before but I have heard of it, but just for fault detection, not as an aid to dismantling seized components. So, I think it's time to go & find some but in the meantime heat & soak cycles will remain the order of the day. If it frees up before the dye arrives I won't mind, just want it in bits,
Thanks all

A good tip for use is to spray it into a container, then decant into a precision applicator or old Singer oiler etc. ie. something that dispenses the stuff accurately, in normal use you just spray it over an area to be checked and wipe off the excess.

Available all over the place at welding supply places, or online say on that auction site, this one £8 delivered and will last a lifetime;

255660688538

ATB, Ed

[thisisdonald]

old vape oil bottles make great (and free) dispensers

[trajectory]

A good tip for use is to spray it into a container, then decant into a precision applicator or old Singer oiler etc. ie. something that dispenses the stuff accurately, in normal use you just spray it over an area to be checked and wipe off the excess.

Available all over the place at welding supply places, or online say on that auction site, this one £8 delivered and will last a lifetime;

255660688538

ATB, Ed

Thanks, I'll take a look at that one. As said I've never actually used this stuff before so I started to have a look around & saw that it's available with developer & cleaner but surmised its just the dye I'm after. So, yep I will have a look at that.

I know this sight is giving me a bit of a hard time but rather weirdly I'm quite enjoying the process of learning new methods to try. I've done heat & dismantling fluid before & it's worked but new methods & concoctions is all part of the fun....well fun when you don't have commercial pressures added into the equation.

This ones a bit of a fiddle, even had to make a custom cradle to hold it securely & support it while still giving access to the wheel & have enough clearance for a bit of rotation (I can hope) when the grips are on it.

[trajectory]

In case anyone was wondering the sight is still frozen solid. Call it seized, jammed, rusted, corroded, electrolytically interacted whatever you like but it ain't moving.

Still awaiting the penetrant dye.

Tried a bit of home formulated eds red, but no joy.

It's sitting in ATF & solvent at the moment after a couple more warmings.

As Dick Dasterdly said ' drat, drat & double drat!"

[trajectory]

Another update.

The ATF & solvent didn't appear to do anything spectacular, which was a bit disappointing & I was on the verge of giving up trying to get the sight appart.

Theres a fine line between knowing when to stop & carrying on. Sometimes the line can get a little blurred when you think to yourself one more crack at it....& wish you hadn't. Well I couldn't see a way around it & despite being fully aware that the wheel was relatively fragile I burred the edges up in trying to rotate it. Miffed & annoyed with myself I had a lasting memorial to overdoing it, it wasn't totally wrecked but it wasn't how it started off & it still wasn't free. Not a good situation.

However a pal who is a very skilful engineer got involved & a plan was evolved. Start from first principles. Pop the sight into a jar of dismantling fluid, soak for a goodly while & try to free the parts. Voila, a fraction of a turn on the wheel. Ultrasonic tank to try & get a bit more movement, it eased the wheels movement a bit but the sight blade still wouldnt shift & still the wheel wouldnt turn much.

Bit more wiggling but the wheel wouldnt lift the sight blade. My understanding is that the sight wheel & blades were matched & hand fitted when new & to avoid or reduce lag or backlash, call it what you will, the upper & lower faces of the wheel were fitted so as to be in close contact with the top & bottom of the gate in the blade. Now with all the corrosion etc there was nowhere for the wheel to go, up or down. Thats why the wheel would only turn a fraction. Not only that, the blade was held tightly in the sight base with the corrosion, & the screw alone wouldn't shift it. Next thought was what are the options now? It was decided that the blade be cut, downwards at the edge of the wheel & the centre section of the blade be removed. If the wheel continued to turn it could be simply unscrewed from the base & be removed from the top as nothing impeded its path. Sounds drastic, but nothing else worked & it also gave a path for the remainder of the sight blade to exit the base should it too be freed up, as the wheel would be out there was nothing to stop it being removed upward, assuming it could be freed. Well the screw came out ok. The base remnant of the blade came free too, once a drift had been ground to match the small edge sections of the blade which are visible from under the base in the grooves. It was a simple matter of carefully tapping from side to side to get the blade removed, once the corrosion lock had been broken

Sight base, screw, & blade, all sitting on the bench, happy bunny, very happy bunny. What followed was a detailed clean up of the channels, restoration of the wheel (it needed trueing up, de burring/ skimming & knurling ) & welding the sight blade back together, new notch cut etc. Then hand fitting the parts & re finishing.

Ok this is a lot of work to get a rear sight working again. Needs a fair bit of kit too, but its doable. Lots of old turret style sights of similar design ( Webley mk 111, early Airsporter .....?) get stiff or stuck & respond to dismantling fluid & or heat cycles but this one was probably as extreme as an example that could be encountered but maybe it offers a route out of the situation should anyone encounter a similar one. It retains the original parts too. Not for everyone I guess, but thought it might be worth posting the outlines of the method that's worked for this one. A very high quality piece of work, thank you.

[isobar]

well done,i have been following this drama.you had to break a few eggs to make the omelette but that's the way it goes sometimes.

[micky2]

Glad you have got it sorted out in the end.

[trajectory]

Thank you isobar & micky2, I appreciate your comments