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Thread: 20 Calibre saves a lot of hassle discuss

  1. #76
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    Is it any wonder the country's in a mess.. Here we are having a debate on a cal choice and here we are going around in circles not getting anywhere on a small subject of cal choice..,
    Those that like the cal defending it and giving opinions on its merit..
    Those that can not see the point of .20 and would rather shoot .177 .22..
    What is the point in these debates?

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by prosport.177 View Post
    Is it any wonder the country's in a mess.. Here we are having a debate on a cal choice and here we are going around in circles not getting anywhere on a small subject of cal choice..,
    Those that like the cal defending it and giving opinions on its merit..
    Those that can not see the point of .20 and would rather shoot .177 .22..
    What is the point in these debates?
    You would have thought that those that shoot .20 could discuss the merits of the cal between .20 shooters.

    I myself give up reading some replies, due to them having a lot to say that is not relevant to anything other than there own blinkered views, I mean how many ways can you say the same thing and not be seen as trolling a thread
    HW77+7 KLIP SPRINGER

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by HW777 View Post
    You would have thought that those that shoot .20 could discuss the merits of the cal between .20 shooters.

    I myself give up reading some replies, due to them having a lot to say that is not relevant to anything other than there own blinkered views, I mean how many ways can you say the same thing and not be seen as trolling a thread
    Surely the whole point of a BBS is to discuss different opinions, & call out the groundless 'old wives tails' ?
    6 pages of blinkers, discussion & disagreement with a bit of banter & no real insults

    This thread amongst .20 shooters would be very short & pretty pointless, because we agree on it's merits, & mostly wish H&N still made the pellet range they used to.

  4. #79
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    .20 is such a superb calibre that pellet makers give you loads of options..... oh no..... they dont...

    .20 is such a superb calibre that gun makers give you loads of options..... oh no..... they dont...

    It never caught on. It never will. Its probably academic as we might have a total lead ammo ban anyway.

    In .177 and .22 there is a huge range of makers, styles, grain weight, head size etc that can cover everything that the niche and unpopular .20 can do.

    You can argue as much as you like but .20 is no force in the market place. Makers of pellets don't support it. Gun makers offer few options. Sub 12 shooters don't buy into it.

    If you like it and want restricted options at almost every level then fine... .20 meets your limited options. In fact, the only advantage of .20 I can see is you have much less choice in finding the right pellet is potentially easier.

    Its personal choice but lack of choice over very questionable benefits is not a personal choice I would choose or recommend to anyone.

    As there is a shortage of almost all ammo types, selecting a cal that has a very limited application in its niche is not going to help anyone.

    .20 holds no magic chalice for me that cannot be totally covered in .177 from ultra lite to uber heavy when it comes to sub 12 users.

    If your FAC.... then .22 upwards make sense.
    In a battle of wits I refuse to engage with an unarmed person.
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  5. #80
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    I agree there is too much argument for argument sake.

    With 12ft/lbs rifles the only thing that delivers, matters, is perfect shot placement. Be that hunting or competitions.
    All the calibres require doing a drop chart.
    The higher the velocity the flatter the shooting, and longer the Point Blank range.
    Few people can equal a laser rangefinder for judging range.
    Beyond 20m then rangefinding gets really tricky.
    No calibre has the smack power to compensate for poor shot placement.

    Getting all the calibres to shoot well is shooting time. Whats not to love? "Best" is making a perfect shot placement. Easiest at the longer ranges is the .177. All take real application to hit tiny every time.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephyr View Post
    Iím not disagreeing with you - I thought that as well, as do others I have chatted with over the years. Maybe I misunderstood when HFT was born out of FT, or has history been re-written by those who werenít there, or maybe it is just the progression of the sport? Admittedly more and more silhouettes are of geometric shapes or non-quarry creatures (birds of prey, wolves, monkeys, bulls and a whole host of different birds) or other things (Aeroplanes, hand grenade and dragons). But the feedback from official UKAHFT sources is that HFT is a target competition and not meant to simulate hunting (despite íHunterí being part of the name), which is used to explain some of the rules.

    This doesnít add anything to the calibre debate, but does let me express some of my Ďgrumpy old maní views to somebody other than my long suffering wife and kids.
    Thank you for that. Yes the sport has evolved over the years and gotten a bit politically correct. Which could be due to them trying to step away completely from hunting i.e.. Lead Ban etc.
    If you look past the boll****, the fundamentals are the same as most hunting scenarios with distance and angles and no bench to rest on.
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  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steyr View Post
    .20 is such a superb calibre that pellet makers give you loads of options..... oh no..... they dont...

    .20 is such a superb calibre that gun makers give you loads of options..... oh no..... they dont...

    It never caught on. It never will. Its probably academic as we might have a total lead ammo ban anyway.

    In .177 and .22 there is a huge range of makers, styles, grain weight, head size etc that can cover everything that the niche and unpopular .20 can do.

    You can argue as much as you like but .20 is no force in the market place. Makers of pellets don't support it. Gun makers offer few options. Sub 12 shooters don't buy into it.

    If you like it and want restricted options at almost every level then fine... .20 meets your limited options. In fact, the only advantage of .20 I can see is you have much less choice in finding the right pellet is potentially easier.

    Its personal choice but lack of choice over very questionable benefits is not a personal choice I would choose or recommend to anyone.

    As there is a shortage of almost all ammo types, selecting a cal that has a very limited application in its niche is not going to help anyone.

    .20 holds no magic chalice for me that cannot be totally covered in .177 from ultra lite to uber heavy when it comes to sub 12 users.

    If your FAC.... then .22 upwards make sense.

    Each to their own and Ive already made up my own mind what cal I'll use
    Last edited by HW777; 09-02-2023 at 12:45 AM.
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  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by prosport.177 View Post
    Is it any wonder the country's in a mess.. Here we are having a debate on a cal choice and here we are going around in circles not getting anywhere on a small subject of cal choice..,
    Those that like the cal defending it and giving opinions on its merit..
    Those that can not see the point of .20 and would rather shoot .177 .22..
    What is the point in these debates?
    What is the point of any debate?
    To thrash out opinions and come to a conclusion or compromise.
    Without debate, your opinion stands alone, unchallenged and like an untested theory.
    During debate where there is fact and reason handed around, it is an opportunity to learn from others experience and wisdom (Mr AB respect).
    If banter can be added all the better.
    VAYA CON DIOS

  9. #84
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    About half usual number on guntrader - so some folk buy them, more so recently it seems -

    Donít come up s/h much

    Maybe all the ones sold over the years are just decorative items ÖÖ..

    Who remembers people chucking out records ?
    They are now like £35 ? And didnít more turntables get sold in Uk a couple of years ago than ever before ?

    I doubt 20 cal is fading away, as others have pointed out if a lead ban comes in 177 ainít gonna be a lot of use 😂
    Looking for TO-6 Trigger unit unmessed with or T0-6 kit for 34

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by HW777 View Post
    Each to their own and Ive already made up my own mind what cal I'll use
    Congratulations. You like .20 - great. Despite reasoned argument you want to shoot. 20. Thats no problem at all.

    This is a forum so you are going to get differing views. They are not blinkered nor ignorant simply because you don't agree. But you are wrong.

    There are +++ and --- for all things and the .20 argument is no different.

    However the limitations far outweigh the benefits and its a non supported cal.

    Between .177 and .22, the choice of pellet styles weights etc etc etc blow .20 out of the water.

    Yes, each to their own but don't tell others there blinkered when the facts are quite clear.
    In a battle of wits I refuse to engage with an unarmed person.
    To one shot one kill, you need to seek the S. Kill only comes from Skill

  11. #86
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    My two fac .20 air rifles use 15.9grain jsb. Absolutely accurate on bunnies and less wind drift and more power retention than the 22jsb 15.9.

  12. #87
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    I love my .20 rifles. I'm just not shooting distances where the trajectory loss makes a massive difference against .177. The only frustrating thing is when I grab a pocketful of pellets for a .22 rifle and then watch one fall down the barrel because I've picked up .20! I've done this a surprising number of times!

  13. #88
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    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by oneseven View Post
    I love my .20 rifles. I'm just not shooting distances where the trajectory loss makes a massive difference against .177. The only frustrating thing is when I grab a pocketful of pellets for a .22 rifle and then watch one fall down the barrel because I've picked up .20! I've done this a surprising number of times!
    Same here.

  14. #89
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    I spoke to UK Neil many moons ago about the possibilities of making a sizing die to take .22 pellets down to .20

    His reply was that he had already been asked about this, I kick myself for not following it up but do wonder if the sizing dies were ever made ?

    Given the do's and don't and narrow view's of some, the simplistic choice of choosing not to having the hassle of pellet selection comes with .20

    .20 has 5 good pellet designs to choose from, no head spin really, buy a .20 rifle you may just be surprised by this cal
    HW77+7 KLIP SPRINGER

  15. #90
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    OP statement was .20 the best sub 12 CAL.
    not FAC or do you like your .20 gun.
    Simple answer is no, it is not the best all round calibre at sub 12
    That is why there are limited guns and limited ammo cos of one simple thing, lack of demand.
    now they have been around a long time and plenty of people have tried them s as no took them out peering or to the club where others see and have a go
    Then most go whatís the point, I donít get it, and stick to .177 of .22
    So the vast majority of people canít be wrong
    Simple really, and as .177 is more versatile at sub 12 than .22, the best all round cal dub 12 is obvious.
    VAYA CON DIOS

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