Germans and their balls

[Jerry Cornelius]

What with haenels, vzs, and lately a .177 Giffard I have become a little more obsessed with balls than is heathy. Specifically German balls.

Why are there so many lead balls available in Germany, in such a range of fractionally different sizes? I’ve used number 9 (4.4) for haenels etc for some time, I have some number 10 (4.46) for vzs, but have recently discovered everything from number 7 (4.3) to number 12 (4.61). What are they doing with all these? I know they like their gallery guns but why all the different sized ammo?

[45flint]

What with haenels, vzs, and lately a .177 Giffard I have become a little more obsessed with balls than is heathy. Specifically German balls.

Why are there so many lead balls available in Germany, in such a range of fractionally different sizes? I’ve used number 9 (4.4) for haenels etc for some time, I have some number 10 (4.46) for vzs, but have recently discovered everything from number 7 (4.3) to number 12 (4.61). What are they doing with all these? I know they like their gallery guns but why all the different sized ammo?

To make it worse the VZ-35 was actually 4.45. The later VZ-47 was 4.46.

[gingernut]

No idea

I use pellets in my Giffard

Just tip them in with a cocktail stick or similar

[Mr. Gen]

I seem to remember there being a song about that.......

[edbear2]

Because they are efficient ond organised by nature I suppose......some could say to a fault......

Anyway, the makers obviously thought it would be good to have all the options covered, by demand or another reason, maybe so shooters could experiment and find the exact size their guns preferred.

I can't believe there were than many miniscule variations of bore size by the makers, I think it was as above (personally, probably wrong though! )

ATB, Ed

[45flint]

Maybe Czechoslovakia didn’t like the Germans for some reason? Sad part is H&N used to make quality balls in all the sizes, no more. Bought a lifetime supply of their 4.45 from a dealer in Canada with old stock. These small difference do make a difference in accuracy, so little of the ball engages the rifling? Most all the balls on the market now are not that consistent. The right size ball in my Z35 shows it is very accurate.

[T 20]

I seem to remember there being a song about that.......

I always felt sorry for Goebbels --- bereft in the ball department.

[draitzer]

Given the popularity of "nominal 4mm" Zimmerstutzens from a tremendous variety of low-volume makers in the late 1800's, I've assumed that bore size and rifling varied enough that precision shooting required the ideal size to fit a particular gun. Those Bürger were serious about their accuracy.

Don R.

[slow_runner]

I always felt sorry for Goebbels --- bereft in the ball department.

Propaganda on the Reich Minister of Propaganda. How apt

[edbear2]

Propaganda on the Reich Minister of Propaganda. How apt

All explained in this documentary;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNa1RYgV17o

ATB, ED

[evert]

A modern plastic "tin" of RWS 4mm flobert Cartridges describes them as "4mm lang mit kugel nr. 7"
So maybe the number seven balls are for something as obscure as flobert reloading???

[Farsight]

Given the popularity of "nominal 4mm" Zimmerstutzens from a tremendous variety of low-volume makers in the late 1800's, I've assumed that bore size and rifling varied enough that precision shooting required the ideal size to fit a particular gun. Those Bürger were serious about their accuracy.

Don R.

That's about the size of it !

[Jerry Cornelius]

It turns out there was an interesting answer to this and a specific sort of German shooting, a bit like our bell target I guess:

https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimmerstutzen

(In German but you can translate in safari at least, though you do get some comic results, eg apparently the shooting is called “room nozzle”, which I guess sounds better in German)

Some shooters therefore use (sometimes mysterious) means to anoint the balls to improve shooting precision; oiling the balls before shooting is commonplace

I have not tried this myself but will certainly now consider anointing my balls before shooting to see if it improves my performance

[gingernut]

Never helped my shooting much

[Jerry Cornelius]

Never helped my shooting much

I think you need to use Präzisionsschießballöl