When was the last time that AA or HW brought out a new springer

[look no hands]

Most of the development for a new springer has been done
For sub 12 a 99 sized break barrel with a one piece cocking lever so it doesn't eat itself and a Rekord, T06 or CD trigger.

Don't need a one piece cocking lever, none of my BSA's have eaten themselves with their articulated levers, just use that design.

[look no hands]

Wouldn’t it be great if AA or HW buy the rights to Walther and some of their machines. I believe they only need to sort out a new trigger unit. Surely this would cost much less than developing something new and untested?

Basically the LGU was a TX200, so wouldn't be worth it, the LGV on the other hand, that's a different kettle of fish, the problem with the LGV are they are too heavy and the barrels are too long, especially once a silencer has been added.

[Waddy]

I can see why Weihrauch make the range they do, if they introduced one "sorted" rifle for the sub 12 market they'd probably only sell that one here & folks wouldn't buy several rifles looking for the right one for them.

As for AA, no idea why they don't do a special version of the TX with the insides like the tuners do them for the UK market.

The money they are charging these days they ought to at least lighten & glide the piston & fit delrin guides.


Or maybe its like a cure for cancer, if someone worked out how to make the perfect sub 12 springer they'd be bumped off & their work would disappear.

.

[look no hands]

I can see why Weihrauch make the range they do, if they introduced one "sorted" rifle for the sub 12 market they'd probably only sell that one here & folks wouldn't buy several rifles looking for the right one for them.

As for AA, no idea why they don't do a special version of the TX with the insides like the tuners do them for the UK market.

The money they are charging these days they ought to at least lighten & glide the piston & fit delrin guides.


Or maybe its like a cure for cancer, if someone worked out how to make the perfect sub 12 springer they'd be bumped off & their work would disappear.

.

None of the Venom guys ever got bumped off and Nick G is still with us, not sure if you where referring to HW regarding the glided pistons but AA already do it, Venom used solid metal guides in their tunes and kits, it's all to do with the fit and finish, which the manufacturers don't have time to do (well they could but profit gets in the way, so they don't), Delrin is cheaper and easier to machine than steel and the spring doesn't twang as much on Delrin, so if you don't get the tolerances spot on, then it's a bit more forgiving.

[TonyL]

HW don't need to be looking at new avenues and ventures and risk spoiling what they have....in the main, excellent rifles of high quality, built to standards most others could only dream of. So they're better off sticking with what they know and not risking compromising things.

I know the HW35 may not be everyone's cup of tea, but consider........a rifle that was launched in the 1950s. Yes, one or two tweaks and improvements over its long, long life. Boasting a trigger that's still regarded as a benchmark today and this high quality, built to last rifle can show most much, much newer guns how it should be done.......

[Hsing-ee]

HW don't need to be looking at new avenues and ventures and risk spoiling what they have....in the main, excellent rifles of high quality, built to standards most others could only dream of. So they're better off sticking with what they know and not risking compromising things.

I know the HW35 may not be everyone's cup of tea, but consider........a rifle that was launched in the 1950s. Yes, one or two tweaks and improvements over its long, long life. Boasting a trigger that's still regarded as a benchmark today and this high quality, built to last rifle can show most much, much newer guns how it should be done.......

Quite. Innovation for the sake of it is a feature of the capitalist system, in that when needs are met wants must be generated to produce more sales. A springer is not that complex a machine, it’s more like a ratchet wrench than a motorcycle. Motorcycles continue to evolve as they’re complicated assemblies of multiple systems, while a springer is basically a pump. The HW77 and its daughter the TX200 are the evolutionary end point of the sporting springer. There’s no need to innovate.. refine perhaps.

[Segata]

I wonder what an airgun fully designed by AI would be like

Based on what I've seen AI do so far with anything gun it will a cross between a Revolver, an AR15 and a kids toy and knowing AI shoot nothing more than Air as it took the prompt too literal.

[flyingfish]

I know the HW35 may not be anyones cup of tea, but consider........a rifle that was launched in the 1950s. Yes, one or two tweaks and improvements over its long, long life. Boasting a trigger that's still regarded as a benchmark today and this high quality, built to last rifle can show most much, much newer guns how it should be done.......[/QUOTE]

Fixed it for you

[oldboyshooter]

Hello, i asked Air Arms that many years ago at a Shooting Show , i quoted the HW 99 as a comparison but they replied, No call for them !!!!!!, Now will they think to import a Springer from the India company ??

[Hsing-ee]

Hello, i asked Air Arms that many years ago at a Shooting Show , i quoted the HW 99 as a comparison but they replied, No call for them !!!!!!, Now will they think to import a Springer from the India company ??

If Air Arms made a 99 type rifle no one would buy their TX. The Indian rifles will be traded in for TXs by their owners when they learn to shoot.

[Barryg]

I know the HW35 may not be anyones cup of tea, but consider........a rifle that was launched in the 1950s. Yes, one or two tweaks and improvements over its long, long life. Boasting a trigger that's still regarded as a benchmark today and this high quality, built to last rifle can show most much, much newer guns how it should be done.......

Fixed it for you[/QUOTE]

It seems that it is only HW that holds on to their old models just look at this Diana not complete list and what has survived to today, I don't think that they can be accused of holding on to old models and some were better that the old 35

[TonyL]

I know the HW35 may not be anyones cup of tea, but consider........a rifle that was launched in the 1950s. Yes, one or two tweaks and improvements over its long, long life. Boasting a trigger that's still regarded as a benchmark today and this high quality, built to last rifle can show most much, much newer guns how it should be done.......

Fixed it for you[/QUOTE]

Lol!::

[TonyL]

Quite. Innovation for the sake of it is a feature of the capitalist system, in that when needs are met wants must be generated to produce more sales. A springer is not that complex a machine, it’s more like a ratchet wrench than a motorcycle. Motorcycles continue to evolve as they’re complicated assemblies of multiple systems, while a springer is basically a pump. The HW77 and its daughter the TX200 are the evolutionary end point of the sporting springer. There’s no need to innovate.. refine perhaps.

Indeed. And, for many, the relationship between man and boinger develops and flourishes due to the human learning the system and bonding with those characterful mechanicals, as opposed to the machine doing all the work for them.

Rising costs etc may well preclude viable, new, freshly designed springers coming to market. Look at the high quality, exquisitely machined FWB Sport "Mark IV" and its disappointing market performance. Despite the superb tolerances and very high quality feel. And Umarex pulling the plug on the Walther LGV/LGU.

Those "price point" (as termed by Tom Gaylord) have got to be affecting springer sales, I guess.....

[Segata]

I held Joffy's FWB and it was a hell of a beautiful thing and well balanced, didn't shoot it sadly but I'd imagine it'd make my BSA feel like one of those barebones cheapo option by comparison, not yet held a AA or HW to compare them though.

[Hsing-ee]

Indeed. And, for many, the relationship between man and boinger develops and flourishes due to the human learning the system and bonding with those characterful mechanicals, as opposed to the machine doing all the work for them.

Rising costs etc may well preclude viable, new, freshly designed springers coming to market. Look at the high quality, exquisitely machined FWB Sport "Mark IV" and its disappointing market performance. Despite the superb tolerances and very high quality feel. And Umarex pulling the plug on the Walther LGV/LGU.

Those "price point" (as termed by Tom Gaylord) have got to be affecting springer sales, I guess.....

There has to be a discernible gain for extra cost and complexity. The Air Arms TX200SR is an interesting example. The action runs on bearings allowing the shooter to be isolated from the mild recoil cycle. The one I had for a while was a truly beautiful specimen with very dark perfect bluing and a lovely dark stock. It was more heavy than a normal full length TX, but not unwieldy. I tested it at Pete’s Airgun Farm in Essex where there’s 50 yards of still air and good lighting. It grouped really well. Then I bought Pete looknohands esrly ProSport .. and it grouped the same. While the SR would give better accuracy from a springer novice and probably edge the ProSport in the hands of an experienced boinger, outside of that windless range there would be no difference in performance. The SR had grommets and plastic or celluloid shims that need replacing, a trigger that flapped like a slack-jawed yokel and a couple of extra pounds weight. It just wasn’t worth it. The ProSport is easier to live with and just as accurate in real-world conditions as are the various TX standard models.

The Walther LGU and LGV conundrum is an interesting one. I tried an LGV and it was effortlessly accurate, really outstanding, without modification. The design is on the whole very thorough and clever. But it feels cheap. The clamshell trigger unit is just urgh. Quite why that offends and the Rekord’s stamped metal cage with its sharp edges and fiddly disassembly I could not tell you. It’s probably the same reason upper management prefer BMW and Mercedes to Lexus. The Lexus is the better vehicle practically but it’s not so ..

It’s a shame the LGV died a death but I’m a hypocrite because I never fancied one even though it would have saved me hours getting other more expensive rifles to shoot as well.

The Feinwerkbau Sporter .. too much bore and stroke for the U.K. not enough for the US. If they had kept the same dimensions as the old Sport I would have bought one, icky rearsight ears and all. But no way would I spend that amount of money on something that needs short stroking or sleeving to get right. And ambidextrous stocks? Pass me the sick bag.

So I guess I’m just another fickle Mary in the land of boing.