.223 newbie questions

[RobinC]

First, to answer the simple query, you match the bullet to the barrel, 1 in 8 twist is ideal for 60 to 80 gn bullets.

The COAL length is specific to the bullet, and the barrel free bore, (i.e where it touches), and is specifically importantly to the load, get it wrong, and you have high pressures!

The wife and I shoot at top level, and shoot Internationally at 300 mts, and load our own ammo (6mmBR and .223) to the highest standards, capable of world level scores at 300 mts, with .223 using 80 gns bullets in a 1 in 8 twist. I do not intend to go into any more detail.

Reloading if performed correctly is safe, BUT, there are big risks for the inexperienced, you are clearly very inexperienced. There are very high pressures involved, and very dangerous repercussions of getting it wrong, possibly fatal.

The NRA report they have seen several serious injuries in 2022 from reloading accidents, and they are considering and will likely be putting in mandatory requirements on reloaded ammo using Bisley and any MoD range.

The questions you are asking, raise serious concerns, and leads me to suggest that before you load any thing at all, that you get proven expert advice, face to face. I suggest you contact the NRA, and get on a NRA reloading course, or as a minimum any reloading course, and get advice from a proven expert.

As a bare minimum get a good book on the subject, and read it cover to cover, to at least understand the requirements, and the risks of getting it wrong, not only to you, but innocent bystanders, then get on a course.

The internet is not the place for you to start getting advice.

Take care, and Have Fun
Robin

[tinbum]

First, to answer the simple query, you match the bullet to the barrel, 1 in 8 twist is ideal for 60 to 80 gn bullets.

The COAL length is specific to the bullet, and the barrel free bore, (i.e where it touches), and is specifically importantly to the load, get it wrong, and you have high pressures!

The wife and I shoot at top level, and shoot Internationally at 300 mts, and load our own ammo (6mmBR and .223) to the highest standards, capable of world level scores at 300 mts, with .223 using 80 gns bullets in a 1 in 8 twist. I do not intend to go into any more detail.

Reloading if performed correctly is safe, BUT, there are big risks for the inexperienced, you are clearly very inexperienced. There are very high pressures involved, and very dangerous repercussions of getting it wrong, possibly fatal.

The NRA report they have seen several serious injuries in 2022 from reloading accidents, and they are considering and will likely be putting in mandatory requirements on reloaded ammo using Bisley and any MoD range.

The questions you are asking, raise serious concerns, and leads me to suggest that before you load any thing at all, that you get proven expert advice, face to face. I suggest you contact the NRA, and get on a NRA reloading course, or as a minimum any reloading course, and get advice from a proven expert.

As a bare minimum get a good book on the subject, and read it cover to cover, to at least understand the requirements, and the risks of getting it wrong, not only to you, but innocent bystanders, then get on a course.

The internet is not the place for you to start getting advice.

Take care, and Have Fun
Robin

Thankyou Robin. I have my well thumbed "Modern reloading" book, but unfortunately, in the world of Richard Lee, Vectan powders simply don't exist! Conversely, on the Vectan loading data, the 50 and 62 grain bullets I have don't exist!?
I have found COL data for the 62 grain on the Hornady website, still struggling to find the same for Winchester 50 grain PSP. I am heading to the gun shop/range/reloading centre later this week and am going to spend time there with their data and load records for the same calibre/powder/bullets. I have also gained information from club members at the range where I am a member.

I have been reloading for handguns for a few years now, it really is childsplay compared to this!

[BigDuncs]

First, to answer the simple query, you match the bullet to the barrel, 1 in 8 twist is ideal for 60 to 80 gn bullets.

The COAL length is specific to the bullet, and the barrel free bore, (i.e where it touches), and is specifically importantly to the load, get it wrong, and you have high pressures!

The wife and I shoot at top level, and shoot Internationally at 300 mts, and load our own ammo (6mmBR and .223) to the highest standards, capable of world level scores at 300 mts, with .223 using 80 gns bullets in a 1 in 8 twist. I do not intend to go into any more detail.

Reloading if performed correctly is safe, BUT, there are big risks for the inexperienced, you are clearly very inexperienced. There are very high pressures involved, and very dangerous repercussions of getting it wrong, possibly fatal.

The NRA report they have seen several serious injuries in 2022 from reloading accidents, and they are considering and will likely be putting in mandatory requirements on reloaded ammo using Bisley and any MoD range.

The questions you are asking, raise serious concerns, and leads me to suggest that before you load any thing at all, that you get proven expert advice, face to face. I suggest you contact the NRA, and get on a NRA reloading course, or as a minimum any reloading course, and get advice from a proven expert.

As a bare minimum get a good book on the subject, and read it cover to cover, to at least understand the requirements, and the risks of getting it wrong, not only to you, but innocent bystanders, then get on a course.

The internet is not the place for you to start getting advice.

Take care, and Have Fun
Robin

Excellent post Robin and full of good info and suggestions.

I shoot around 7 or 8 thousand reloaded rifle rounds annually, more than half being .223 but also 6.5CM and .308. The vast majority of fellow competitors are reloaders too. I have witnessed several potentially serious accidents in the last year due to negligence on the part of reloaders. Without trying to patronise anyone, please be very, very careful and take credible advice as suggested by Robin. Some 'mate's advice' can be downright dangerous.

The most recent incident was during a major competition, pressure on and the shooter fired and was about to chamber another round but the guy behind shouted 'Stop, stop stop'. He (guy behind, unlike the shooter) had realised that it was a squid round, in this case, no powder and it was only the primer that had detonated which dislodged the bullet from the case's neck tension and propelled it some distance up the barrel. The ejected case looked normal but the rifle was in a very dangerous state with a barrel that was blocked.
I believe that in Jun 2021 a similar incident happened on Century and the new target rifle failed destroying the rifle although thankfully, with no serious injury. This incident may have one of those that contributed to the NRA/MOD's recent comments on reloading safety.

These situations happen when people get distracted during the reloading process. And as someone who has reloaded several hundred rounds over the weekend, I know only too well how mind numbingly boring the process can be and how critical it is to develop a systemic routine that leaves no (minimal) margin for error.

Keep safe and have fun.

[tinbum]

Thankfully a shorter COL only reduces pressure in a necked case, rather than the increase I'm used to. Todays testing showed a best 50 grain group of 42mm, and 62 grain of 36mm. A little more on the COL should improve things, and a trigger with a less than 8lb weight has to help!

[Fox Tales]

Thankfully a shorter COL only reduces pressure in a necked case, rather than the increase I'm used to. Todays testing showed a best 50 grain group of 42mm, and 62 grain of 36mm. A little more on the COL should improve things, and a trigger with a less than 8lb weight has to help!

You've put the cart before the horse .

Firstly , regardless of how a case is sized , a reduction in c.o.l will cause a reduction in case capacity and an increase in pressure , not a decrease .

If you're trigger is so heavy as to affect your ability to shoot accurately, how can you trust your results . I suggest you sort the trigger then start again.

I'm not sure why , but you appear to be in an awful hurry . You say you're new to reloading and then have jumped in feet first .

If you're intent on doing seating tests , find the lands first , modern thinking suggests seating 0.020 " from the lands when doing initial development of charge weights . Though , magazine length may be a limiting factor as may bullet length if there is to be sufficient in the case neck . Then after charge weight tests do your seating tests .

My suggestion would be to use the bullet manufacturers recommended c.o.l .

You may struggle to get out to 800 metres as it's doubtful that a 16" barrel will give sufficient velocity for the bullet to remain super sonic at that distance .

Good luck , I hope you achieve the results you're looking for .

[tinbum]

1: If you're trigger is so heavy as to affect your ability to shoot accurately, how can you trust your results . I suggest you sort the trigger then start again.

I'm not sure why , but you appear to be in an awful hurry . You say you're new to reloading and then have jumped in feet first .

1: See my last post dated the 10th

2: I'm not new to reloading, just .223

[Fox Tales]

1: See my last post dated the 10th

2: I'm not new to reloading, just .223

1 , read it before , have you sorted the trigger or developed forearms like Popeye?

2 , the title implies your new to reloading , which makes me wonder why start this thread if that's not the case ? Especially, since reloading principles are applicable regardless of chambering .

I suspect that what you really wanted was advice on powder choice and load data to suit your rifle barrel . If that is the case , then GRT is your friend, it'll also tell you if you exceed manufacturers maximum c.o.l by that I mean what they deem to be the minimum length of bullet in the case neck .

Regardless, I don't think I've posted any misinformation and was written with good intentions, so hopefully my previous post will be of use to someone who is a newbie .


Please share your results , it's always good to see a conclusion.

[tinbum]

1 , read it before , have you sorted the trigger or developed forearms like Popeye?

2 , the title implies your new to reloading , which makes me wonder why start this thread if that's not the case ? Especially, since reloading principles are applicable regardless of chambering .

I suspect that what you really wanted was advice on powder choice and load data to suit your rifle barrel . If that is the case , then GRT is your friend, it'll also tell you if you exceed manufacturers maximum c.o.l by that I mean what they deem to be the minimum length of bullet in the case neck .

Regardless, I don't think I've posted any misinformation and was written with good intentions, so hopefully my previous post will be of use to someone who is a newbie .


Please share your results , it's always good to see a conclusion.

You are entirely correct. Title should have been ".223 newbie, questions"

[pnuk]

Excellent post Robin and full of good info and suggestions.

I shoot around 7 or 8 thousand reloaded rifle rounds annually, more than half being .223 but also 6.5CM and .308. The vast majority of fellow competitors are reloaders too. I have witnessed several potentially serious accidents in the last year due to negligence on the part of reloaders. Without trying to patronise anyone, please be very, very careful and take credible advice as suggested by Robin. Some 'mate's advice' can be downright dangerous.

The most recent incident was during a major competition, pressure on and the shooter fired and was about to chamber another round but the guy behind shouted 'Stop, stop stop'. He (guy behind, unlike the shooter) had realised that it was a squid round, in this case, no powder and it was only the primer that had detonated which dislodged the bullet from the case's neck tension and propelled it some distance up the barrel. The ejected case looked normal but the rifle was in a very dangerous state with a barrel that was blocked.
I believe that in Jun 2021 a similar incident happened on Century and the new target rifle failed destroying the rifle although thankfully, with no serious injury. This incident may have one of those that contributed to the NRA/MOD's recent comments on reloading safety.

These situations happen when people get distracted during the reloading process. And as someone who has reloaded several hundred rounds over the weekend, I know only too well how mind numbingly boring the process can be and how critical it is to develop a systemic routine that leaves no (minimal) margin for error.

Keep safe and have fun.

Exactly the reason I always wear eye protection. You never know what is in the chamber of the rifle next to you.

[tinbum]

More specifically weighed rounds made today with varying COL's. I will probably wait until the new trigger springs arrive before testing this time as I think I've reached the limit of accuracy with something so heavy