Cheats

[sparky]

Has anyone got some pics of the right way for all stances as have always been a little confused and dont do comps at the moment but if i did would at least like to know iam doing it right

http://www.ukahft.co.uk/2008/rules.htm

Pete

[Snapshot]

Pics are on the UKAHFT web site.

Jonathan

[Steve L]

I also have seen people hit things other than the target & say 'oh just the one' wouldn't mind but you don't even hear the sound of pellet on metal, not too obviuos
Oh & Daz, cheers for nobblin' me out of a gold as well

[Abes]

Cheers thats something eles to pratice now then (will it never end) lol

[Pete_Shearer]

We have similiar problems in our FT club. The most frustrating thing we see is that a number of so-called 'A' graders neglect to submit their card at the end of the shot if their score in not within 'A' grade.
The only people their kidding is themselves, their reputation is pretty bad from the less immortals of the Bs and Cs who quite honestly do not look up to them at all. To hear them bragging about scores, courses too easy etc etc and then when they fail to perform ditch their scorecards is a joke.
At least the crowd I shot with are honest, bad shoot bad card still goes in.

[nibbley-uk]

We have similiar problems in our FT club. The most frustrating thing we see is that a number of so-called 'A' graders neglect to submit their card at the end of the shot if their score in not within 'A' grade.
The only people their kidding is themselves, their reputation is pretty bad from the less immortals of the Bs and Cs who quite honestly do not look up to them at all. To hear them bragging about scores, courses too easy etc etc and then when they fail to perform ditch their scorecards is a joke.
At least the crowd I shot with are honest, bad shoot bad card still goes in.

Totally agree all cards should be handed in, it will only make you a better person if you take the losses with the wins.
I hear some people in FT shoot to miss to keep their score low too so they dont go up a grade. I would of thought it was a great honour to go up the ranks???

[nibbley-uk]

I know of people that have shot at the plate of a already down target and claim the 2 then pull the target up with delight.

If people are slow in front i know of people who jump past to empty lanes.......why, its not a race its not first back gets prize, just chill and get to know the people you are shooting with.
And why do it, is it avoiding windy parts of the course only to come back to the targets when wind has died, or is it to avoid people seeing you miss so that when you card a 59 no one can say well actually i saw you miss 2.

Only a marshall should go out to a faulty target to rectify a problem or a called target, if the marshall needs help with that target then a competitor who has already shot that target should go assist.

And 2 points should only awarded if the target has gone down no matter if the shooter says he saw the pellet hit the middle of the kill.
Ive seen many shots show dead centre of the kill on a relativley easy shot in fact i have seen this happen with the two guys i shot with not long ago, both claimed it must be dodgy target i shot it the target went down, but because we were still not sure the marshall checked the target and as we were the first to shoot this freshly painted target he showed us 2 marks where the pellet hit the side of the kill and bounced into the middle leaving 2 perfect round pellet marks.
They woulod of sworn blind the target was faulty until seeing this so it is something to look for.

[Poltroon]

I've not been at this HFT game for long, but have already had experience of a shooter claiming 'just the one' despite neither myself or the guy we were shooting with seeing or hearing a strike. We both asked if he was sure and the sudden loss of eye contact said it all really.

I think the guy was under the impression that he had a reputation to uphold, but he really wasn't fooling anybody but himself.

I guess myself and my other shooting partner are equally to blame for allowing him to get away with it. Won't happen again though as I intend to take a much harder line next time having read this thread.

Mind you, the vast majority of people I've shot with have been nothing but honest and a pleasure to shoot with...

[kieran turner]

This cheating lark is a kind of weird topic to discuss, I've known very very commendable people accused of cheating and it was simply un-true, but hey ho. What goes around comes around I always say

As for seeing cheating, I've only seen it a couple of times(not the kneeling rule) and I've had a quite word with the people thats done it, most of the time it's something like a kid has put his gun down on his bean bag and it's turned his sidewheel atleast a quarter of a turn and then he's moved it back. I've seen this with my very own eyes(not at a UKAHFT).

So do say sorry mate you have to shoot the rest of the course with a 10y px or let it go, in my eyes this isn't cheating it's just plain unlucky, if you had to shoot the rest of the course like that you would be very very disheartened and it would probably spoil your day.

IMO you only cheat yourself and if a piece of plastic is that improtant that you will go to extreme lenghts such as cheating to get it then you are a very hollow person.

[Jega]

Although im fairly new to HFT i reckon the way that the NEFTA hunter series is scored takes some beating. Quite simply we all mark each others score cards then add them up and sign them before handing them back to the office.
I don't think i've ever seen anyone cheat ,exactly the opposite to be honest
at our last comp my two lane mates and i thought we blanked a real awkward shot only when we bumped into the sadist who set the course did we realise we all got a 1.On another occasion the guy in front of us thought he blanked a fairly easy shot, only when my lad pulled the reset string did he realise he got a 2.So i reckon 99.9%of the guys out there as a straight as a die,a little disturbed maybe but straight

[MattW]

We are nothing without honour...

I don't shoot ft / hft, but I'm in a couple of postal pistol comps (most people shooting on home ranges with no witnesses) - it would be so easy to cheat on these, but you have to rely on honesty and honour.

I see no sense in cheating in ft / hft - if you're that insecure, perhaps you need a different hobby.

cheers
Matt

[steveggg]

DAZ,

It's a shame that some people have to stoop this low, HFT and FT is a sport and as such is something you do for fun, sure we would all like to WIN, but at any cost no thanks.

Trust amongst like minded people is the most important thing that is being damaged when people do this.

Anyone who sees anyone doing this, no matter what their reputation, should make their shooting partner and marshalls aware.

They are only fooling themselves.

[navybloke]

In addition Dad is coaching said lad. Not in terms of shot post-mortem but before each peg.

It's a fair point about the cushion thing - I think they introduce an unecessary element of artificiality anyway and should be binned, but rules are rules and we should stick with them. However, do you really begrudge a father coaching his lad round the course? What could he really do other than suggest a range or a good position to take the shot from? If it's really an issue then could there not be a case for not taking things quite so seriously? Just a thought, offered in a spirit of friendly enquiry!

As to claiming plates for misses - yes, it's dead wrong, but if someone's that small-minded then I'd have no problem with giving them a doughnut and letting them argue the toss with me and with the marshals.

Here's one for you, though. I shot Basingstoke this year with a bloke who plated the wrong target - I didn't realise he was aiming off. He wasn't in the running for a top spot so I gave him a point - he was happy, and I was happy. I shot Basingstoke last year (second HFT shoot, a nightmare) and saw someone watch their partner take aim at the wrong target, take the shot and drop the target, then instantly say; "that's a zero, I'm afraid". I figured that was pretty unsporting. What say you?

Cheers,

[nibbley-uk]

DAZ,

It's a shame that some people have to stoop this low, HFT and FT is a sport and as such is something you do for fun, sure we would all like to WIN, but at any cost no thanks.

Trust amongst like minded people is the most important thing that is being damaged when people do this.

Anyone who sees anyone doing this, no matter what their reputation, should make their shooting partner and marshalls aware.

They are only fooling themselves.

Exactly Steve, the whole point is what we do is for fun and the people who bend the rules or blatently cheat are only going to found out sooner or later.
Im sure that if everyone is aware of what happens then people are less likely to try it on.

[The Pie Man]

I have shot with cheats, socialized with them, listened to people talk about them, speak about them myself, I have a mate who is a blatant cheat but in all honesty and being serious nothing will stop a cheat cheating!!
There a different class of shooter tbh, there obsessed and a cheat can be driven by either peer pressure, reputation, saving face, a bet, and even something as trivial as mates taking the piss.
Some cheats are blatant, some who are devious, and don’t forget the naïve, there classed as cheats as well (unfortunately).
I once saw someone arrive at a set of 3 targets in a well known comp, and realise there all sub 20yrds and adjust his scope accordingly as it was put on to his bag, now I stood and watched this but said nothing(not Marshalling at the time), the reason being it’s up to them, they are only cheating themselves.
I’ve seen a previous shooting partner call a plate when the friggin pellet is still going..
I have even heard about a group of guys, watch another shooters movements throughout a 30 shot course to prove a point at club level.
I can’t and will never understand how 2 points can be awarded unless the target actually fell down, or at least moved half way and got caught, with physical evidence.
The simple fact is, no matter what marks are on the kill/plate if the damn thing stays up its 1 point, if the target is deemed faulty then a second shot should be awarded to prove you can get it down surely.
just My 2p.