Air filled alternative to co2 cartridges

[springfieldm6]

Anyone seen or experienced these:

http://www.pickeringgunssales.co.uk/...584/category=0

They're an air cylinder that you charge via a pump or bottle that I guess is the same size as a 12g co2 capsule. I seem to remember Brocock making something similar a number of years ago, though it can't have been popular as it wasn't around for long.

Springfieldm6

[scrapman]

I seem to remember Brocock making something similar a number of years ago, though it can't have been popular as it wasn't around for long.

Springfieldm6

They did, and it was far less expensive - around £25 I seem to remember. Brocock's version could be charged in an adaptor that screwed onto any of their TAC pumps.

I tried to order a couple while they were still being advertised but all the suppliers were all sold out. That was shortly after the govt. in its infinite wisdom decreed that all Brocock 'tandem air cartridge' guns and their shells would henceforth require a FAC (despite the fact that .177 items couldn't be converted to fire live rounds, and the police had only ever found 6 converted .22s, which apparently somehow became 65 in the report submitted to the government). It's possible that their air capsule got caught up in that particular round of panicked knee-jerk reactions to some loosely wrapped maniac doing what loosely wrapped maniacs do.

It's a great idea but £72 seems a bit excessive, though I suppose if you get through the CO2 capsules at a rate of knots it might make sense.

On Edit: Just found an old thread here about the Brockock air capsules: http://www.airgunbbs.com/showthread....Co2-Bulb-Size). Apparently they changed hands for rather more than I remember.

[GRAZY]

Cool. Not sure on 200 bar though. I always thought the 12 gram capsules were less.

[Vic Thompson]

I had brought one of the original Proton X items some years ago, along with a charging adapter, and paid £80 for the privilege. It was an abject failure in my eyes, ten good shots and then a few more with much diminished energy. It was described to me as a reservoir with a large chamber feeding through to a small chamber via a very small hole. At the end of the second chamber was a schrader valve held open by the CO2 piercing pin on the host item. Each firing emptied the small chamber which then filled up slowly from the main chamber. On the version that I brought there was no pressure regulation employed on the second cylinder. I don't know what the stored energy in that cylinder from a 200 Bar fill, but I'm guessing that it's only a fraction of the energy stored in a conventional CO2 capsule of the same size.

I used mine a few times and then gave up. If the current offering is any better I'd be interested to read a technical review of them in operation. There is a Robert Lane video of the Brocock one which is regulated and appears to be of a different design to the Proton X one that I once had.

Vic Thompson.

[gingernut]

Lot less at Blackpool Air Rifles.
The 88gram one seems a more logical buy.
Still got my Brocock 12 gram one.
Think that needed 230 bar as well.
Worked well but only 20 shots - higher fps tho.

[trevor1]

I reckon CO2 was brewing's great gift to airgunning. In a trice we had recoilless,repeating air guns. On top of that they were not overly expensive. Most were durable and easy to fix if necessary.I'd have thought such guns(if allowed) would go down famously in a country with a 12 ft lb m.e limitation for most air rifles -but maybe not. I recall back in the 60s to 80s I paid 90cents for a box of 6 Crosman Powerlets.OR $19 for an outer of 20 boxes(x5 Powerlets)..and that included postage.I could afford to keep all my gas guns charged and shooting.If the UK hadn't had such fixed laws about CO2 I doubt the air cartridge system would have seen the light of day. The thought of the "golden years" Crosmans reaching the market must have caused sleepless nights at Webley and BSA...-Who said,"they already couldn't sleep 'cos of Weihrauch and Diana????"

[gingernut]

The number of old American co2 pistols that appeared for sale here after the ban was lifted was interesting.
Who would have thought so many had been held on licence?

[air-tech]

Somewhere out there one can even find instructions to convert a used capsule to HPA.

No, you are not supposed to fill these to 200 bar.

Secondly there is a problem with air. It is still gaseous at those pressures, so there really is a hell of a lot less of it than there is CO2, where part of the capsule contents are liquid.

So the pressure drop off is very rapid.

Whereas, with CO2, apart from there being more of it, the pressure is self regulating (for a set temperature) as long as there still is some liquid in the capsule. In other words, the pressure in the capsule at temperature "X" will always be (say) 900 p.s.i. no matter how many shots you have fired (again, as long as part of the CO2 is still in liquid form.)

[Shed tuner]

Carl nailed it.
Storage gas (air) vs storing a liquid which vapourises to a gas and maintains constant pressure until all the liquid is gone... stick with Co2 carts, massively more stored energy and consistency. And cheep

[harvey_s]

^^^ As above...Pressure in air cart. will fall after the first shot....Brocock already marketed it as a product and was useless the first time round - Nothings changed

[gingernut]

Mine worked ok.
Maybe people did not fill them as high as they should.

[harvey_s]

Mine worked ok.
Maybe people did not fill them as high as they should.

If you got 50 consistent shots out of one - My massive knob's a huge kipper and we're all having a lot of fish for tea

[GRAZY]

[My knob's a kipper and we're all having fish for tea[/QUOTE]

There so going to put that under your name.

[air-tech]

My massive knob's a huge kipper and we're all having a lot of fish for tea

Haha!

Bit of insurance there, non?

[harvey_s]

I have no idea what you're talking about....